Spot the Fallacies

As an intellectual exercise for a Sunday afternoon, try listing all the fallacies contained in this random Facebook post pertaining to pandemic policy. There could be enough to fill a small library. Whoever this person is, she’s not alone in promoting the fallacy that consensus is the measure of truth, and that dominant paradigms are only ever opposed by “a couple of discredited doctors” anyway.

The inevitable result of a philosophy that enshrines intellectual helplessness is a society in which nearly everyone unthinkingly accepts the ideas of the dominant authority figures no matter where they lead.

141 Replies to “Spot the Fallacies”

  1. Of all the idiocies the last three years, “experts” telling you to not get a second opinion on a “doctor’s” assessment has got to be close to No. 1.

    1. Remember when the experts told us peptic ulcers were caused by stress and spicy foods?

      Dr Barry Marshall, one of Stevie Berryman’s discredited doctors said otherwise. Marshall was ridiculed by the experts.

      In 2005 Marshall and Robin Warren were awarded the Nobel Prize in medicine for their discovery that the Helicobacter Pylori bacteria caused peptic ulcers.

      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Marshall

      1. Turns out that a friend of mine, in addition to being one of the last to defect from the Soviet Union, was one of the first to undergo this treatment. He said it was amazing, after years of suffering and doctors giving “treatment” that didn’t work, or even surgery to remove the ulcer just to have it return almost immediately, to have immediate relief.

        We had spicy Mexican food together – he even eats my coming, which is pretty hot – but says he literally could not sit near someone eating Thai food before. Smelling hot spices would set his ulcer off.

  2. It’s pretty simple to discount the rantings of a narcissist Fauci-worshipper who encourages us (now that the dishonesty rampant in Social Media via active censorship has been made naked) to censor for ourselves. He/Her/Them might just as easily have stated, “You’re not smart enough. Discount your own conclusions. The truth will be delivered from on high.”

    Feynman had it right when he said, “Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts.”

    1. As the College of Psychologists of Ontario is currently in the process of amply demonstrating.

  3. {CDC Director Rochelle Walensky this week declared that “vaccinated people do not carry the virus.”}

    ..the experts.

    Oh, and when they are wrong…it wasnt they were wrong…its the science evolved. Now shut up you dumb non experts!

    In a twist of irony….my opinion was actually more correct than the actual experts! Who’d have thunk it…considering i only have high school science classes under my belt..

    1. You probably went to high school at a time when one’s genitals (hardware) not one’s delusion’s (software) defined gender.

      Science is now situational. It is actually remarkable that we’re instructed to worship the words of two old white men, Joe Biden and Anthony Fauci in regard to Covid. Surely this reinforces White Male Patriarchy science.

      1. Damn my colonial educational background!!

        I ended up working in IT… Which i assume will soon (if not already?!) be considered oppressive and colonial influenced!! Sorry cisco, IBM and others… We are the baddies!

          1. 0s and 1s are obviously binary cisgender constructs. I mean…just look at them.. 0 1 they just scream transphobia!

            Now a 9…it clearly isn’t decided, so should be considered safer for the trans community.

          2. Probably 0’s and 1’s will be changed to 6’s and 9’s and can go any which way and not offend some. I’m not sure what numbering system that would be called. But then numbers are so oppressive.

      2. I went to grade school at a time when they taught us that gender (a grammatical category) was something we had to pay attention to when learning French (because in NY so close to Montreal they didn’t see the point of teaching us Spanish).

    2. I am an expert in bullshit detection. That is what prevented me from NOT buying the covid bullshit. When they pumped out an instant ‘vaccine’ and promoted it to the point where it was get it or lose your job, my BS detector needle was buried in the DON’T DO IT SIDE OF THE DIAL.

      Turns out my humble expertise may have saved my life. Same for my family and most of my acquaintances. I move in a circle of people who understand reality and are also keen detectors themselves.

  4. If your not a expert on experts how could you level a opinion on experts?.. By your own logic? salad tossing is the same as criticism if it is to be judged by who is delivering it..

  5. Well, my non-expertise nonetheless resulted in not having myocarditis, aortic aneurysm, atrial fibrillation, hypertension, thrombosis, stroke, heart attack, runaway cancer, autoimmune diseases, appendicitis, ALS, sudden death, or any other of the multiple issues people are inexplicably suffering (and that’s just in my circle of family and acquaintances). So I think I’ll stick with it, thank you very much, you useless “experts”.

  6. This addresses vital questions…

    Why do I believe what I do? How should I decide — or even should I decide — about contentious issues?

    These are extraordinarily difficult questions to answer, but everyone should try. Many today seem to use political allegiance. “I’m a political XXX. What is the side that XXXs are supporting these days?”

    1. You’re one to talk, Mr Quad Jabbed. Or is that MrBivalent Jabbed?

      Were you first or second in line for the Quackzines?

      1. Yes, I believe COVID vaccines are worth getting, particular for older people. Young people I don’t, as the risk-reward isn’t strong enough.

        Would you like to debate the issue, DanBC? Cause I can do that.

        Nevermind. I’ve never heard you debate the issue in any constructive way. You prefer insults.

        1. Any idea how many older people in nursing homes died outright from the “vaccines”? I can tell you in the case of my in laws, it’s 2 for 2.

        2. The “experts” say people over 5 years old should get them…every 2-3 months. Thuis spake the Canadians and the CDC.
          WTF is wrong with you, don’t you believe the “experts”?
          You can’t help but shoot yourself in the foot, now can you?

          1. The “experts” say people over 5 years old should get them…every 2-3 months.

            The “experts” say the first and second doses of vaccine should be about 2 months apart. They do NOT say you should continue getting them every two months indefinitely. In most Canadian jurisdictions they don’t even allow that,

          2. “Timing of vaccination
            If it has been 6 months or longer since your last vaccine dose or COVID-19 infection, get your booster to stay up to date on your vaccinations. In some situations, provinces and territories may offer you a booster as soon as 3 months after your last dose.”

            These provinces are experts, no?
            https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/services/diseases/coronavirus-disease-covid-19/vaccines/how-vaccinated.html#a9

            You are an idiot who would have happily swallowed Mengeler’s crapola.

          3. Note the words “In some situations”.

            It may well refer to those who have only had one shot. It does NOT mean “in every circumstance indefinitely.”

    2. “Many today seem to use political allegiance.”

      Seem? Political allegiance and severe allergy to independent thought is all that Jacobins like DanyBS and Hobot got. You’re either with them on every issue or you fail purity test forever and are deemed heretic. Burn the witch!

    1. Ahh yes.
      Hitler liked dogs.
      Hitler liked tea.
      He like advanced weapons.
      He wanted to make Germany an economic powerhouse.
      He wanted to make a 1000 year Reich, and take over the world, kinda like the sponsors of Our World in Data, Bill and Melinda Gates, and the WEF.
      Therefore he was right about everything.
      Your style of argument is that of a severely retarded Hitler youth.

  7. When any opposing view is not only censored but those stating the view are demonized and destroyed , it’s hard to have faith in anything that we are told. Very close to past religious times, believe and state x or you will be burned at the stake. I have a theory that humans have a basic need for a leader or religion that tells them what to do, so that they can do it without thought or question. In the past it was the church. Now it is medical science and climate change. If you want salvation, a long life, a healthy planet, do this! Don’t think, just do!

  8. My favorite fallacy is the assumption that “Expertise” can only exist on the establishment side. Einstein is rolling in his grave.

  9. I only have a high school diploma but I knew that it was a lab leak. I knew lockdowns were a mistake. I knew masks wouldn’t work. I knew the virus was not spread on surfaces. Experts? They are just as likely to be wrong or be bribed or be cowed into submission by threats to their livelihoods as anyone else.

    1. Keith, Keith, Keith … a couple of BRILLIANT medical researchers at MIT. M fkcuing IT !! determined the COVID virus could live on surfaces for up to 2 weeks!!! So please … rubber gloves! And full face mask! Better yet … lock everyone down in their homes!! Mmmmm Eyeeee fkcuing Tee!!! You can’t argue with them … with your high school common sense. Right?

      1. ” … could live on surfaces for up to 2 weeks”

        Could, could, could. Sure. Like your nasal passages. That’s a surface.

        Just like the beer I’m drinking now “could” give a lite-sipping metrosexual the shits.

  10. The most amusing thing about that pile of dog vomit is the author seems to believe that ALL experts in their field agree. If that were the case, we could shut down all the universities and colleges and only have one expert in each subject. The stupid is strong with that one.

  11. The absolute BRILLIANCE of Americas Founders are witnessed by the Electoral College system, enacted to prevent this EXACT thing … the tyranny of the majority. “Consensus” is a term of weakness … going along to get along. Lack of self respect, lack of a coherent personal opinion or personal knowledge.

    1. The Constitution was made for a moral people. That situation no longer exists.
      No amount of bleating, outrage, culls, purges or whatever will change that.
      The only solution, as I see it, is for some forced migrations and then for Red States to secede, and have strong borders…and a few nukes, to keeps the wolves at bay.

  12. I can see where Berryman is coming from. When a strong preponderance of the experts favour one view, they usually turn out to be right.

    But not always, and many fields today seem to have fallen to ideological capture. On some issues, I prefer to take a “probably, but not necessarily” stance.

    1. Einstein, Schroedinger, Max Plank, Sadi Carnot, Faraday, DeBroglie, etc, beg to differ.
      When the majority of experts receive their funding from Big Pharma, AND they feel the need to censor opposing viewpoints on a wholesale basis, it’s a safe assumption that they are wrong. And then there is Pellagra, the establishment was so right, just like they were with Thalidomide and AZT.
      OH, and the establishment, ie the majority of experts also ridiculed Lister, you bald-faced liar.
      KM = Jabber-Wookie.
      Now FO.

        1. And yet you can’t list them.
          Typical.
          You, like much of the west, are willing to outsource your critical thinking abilities to “experts”, instead of assessing data for yourselves, in the light of history and factual data.
          Now go get your nth jab, after all, the experts say every 2 months.
          The best thing about people like you is that Darwin tends to weed you out, sooner rather than later in your case.

        1. I trust you get jabbed every 2 months, like the experts say you should.
          Or are they not right that one should get jabbed every two months?
          Perhaps you should read what Pfizer actually said, when they were forced to release the data.
          Of course, I think you should take Moderna every two months, its got so much more mRNA in it.

        2. For the first time in history, a “vaccine” was not a weakened or disabled form of the virus that the immune system could go at in the bloodstream, but some mRNA that must penetrate the cell walls, get into the endoplasmic reticulum and rely on our own protein translation mechanisms to make the so-called antigen. What turns off the manufacture of the protein? Nobody knows.
          How does it get out of our cells to invoke an immune response? It must break through the cell walls, often destroying the cell, like any other foreign replicator does (ie most virii), killing the host cell in the process.
          FO and get your next shot, you ignoramus.

          1. “you ignoramus”

            Wanne know a good way to determine who NOT TO TRUST?

            Those who throw around insults like confetti at a wedding. Their views might be right or wrong, but they can safely be dismissed as irrelevant.

          2. ““you ignoramus”

            Wanne know a good way to determine who NOT TO TRUST?”

            …and yet you want us to trust the people who would deny us health-care we paid for, try to imprison us with draconian travel rules, and call for our deaths, over and over and over again.
            Oh, and if you a real man, you’d know how to spell “wanna.”
            One question:
            If mRNA is so good, and the experts are right, are you or are you not taking Moderna shots every two months?
            Its a yes or no question, but I’m sure I can only expect a cognitively dissonant answer, instead of the Yes/No that is an actual answer to the question.
            Now keep effing O.

          3. Ha! Not even a cognitive dissonance answer, but rather a claim of moral superiority and totally ignoring the question.
            You are worse than even I expected.

          4. I don’t blame you for insulting. When there’s no repurcussions (beyond the rare removal of a comment), why not?

          5. “…a claim of moral superiority and totally ignoring the question….”

            Talk about a mother of all projections.

        3. Except medical science is chock full of mavericks proving that “muh consensus” was utter bollocks. From Louis Pasteur to John Snow to Barry Marshall to the Food Pyramid to the current Replication Crisis, there’s ample evidence that the “expert” consensus should be viewed with skepticism.

    2. Exactly so, KM. The notion that all experts can be disregarded on everything is the worst kind of post-Modernist idiocy.

      “OK, Mister Disbelieve everything you are told. Step over the side of the building and then tell us that all the physicists are wrong about the theory of gravitation.”

        1. Yes, Einstein was ridiculed by some — especially the Nazis.

          But it’s also true that within a year of Einstein’s original papers on special relativity in 1905, one of the world’s most respected physicists, Max Plank, was writing papers based on it. Within five years, the physics community had pretty much come around. There were some holdouts, but they tended to be older scientists who were no longer doing important research.

          Given how revolutionary and frankly strange Einstein’s theories were, the physicists of the day deserve a lot of credit.

          1. I’m arguing consensus !=science, you are arguing that it does.
            You might as well be a flat-earther.

          2. I’m arguing that, despite invoking instances from science history, you don’t know much about it.

            And the NYT was correct. Not all of Einstein’s ideas were good ones. He became rather stuck in his ways as he grew old.

          3. The Cosmological Constant that the NYT speaks of turned out to be right.
            Even when Einstein was wrong, he was right.
            You continue to show your ignorance.

          4. Given that Einstein changed his mind a couple of times concerning the universal constant, it’s overly generous to claim he was right about it. He was right to initially introduce it, although he did it for the wrong reason — i.e., to stabilize the universe.

    3. You mean like the strong preponderance of the experts who said that stomach ulcers were caused by stress?

        1. And “usually” doesn’t cut it when you are injecting crap into the bodies of people….crap that may be there forever. If a group of experts is wrong about mundane issues it makes no difference….but if it affects enormous numbers it matters MUCHLY.

    4. We don’t know whether or not a strong majority of experts agreed or not because those who didn’t agree were silenced and unpersoned. In some places they can even lose their job for disagreeing.

        1. The example I can give is Dr Francis Christian losing his position in the college of medicine at the UofS in Saskatoon because at a public rally he call for “informed consent” before getting the mRNA jab, as well as pointing out that (at that time) the CDC /WHO did not recommend the jab for children.

          1. You’re talking about COVID vaccines then?

            The case you mention sounds more like authoritarians silencing dissent than simply a question of who better to believe.

    5. “When a strong preponderance of the experts favour one view, they usually turn out to be right.”

      Horseshit.

      Science is not decided by a show of hands.

    6. “When a strong preponderance of the experts favour one view, they usually turn out to be right.”

      Or bought.

  13. Doctors and scientists have had a long history of being wrong.
    Remember, these ‘experts’ once thought that bleeding patients was the best approach.
    And there are a thousand and one other treatments, causes and solutions that they were convinced were right – but were wrong.
    Science is a constant process of learning from your mistakes. It is never settled, even when it appears to be.

  14. If an expert were to tell you that is perfectly safe to leap from a 100 meter cliff, would you do it?

    Experts aren’t right all the time, and not having a critical eye is a good way to walk into disaster.

    1. If an expert was to tell you it’s not safe to jump off a cliff, would you defy them because you have a different opinion?

      1. The operative word in your argument is “an”….as in ONE expert. In matters of importance, a wise person does not consult ONE expert….but many.

        1. A wise person will also recognize that the side of an argument that insists on coercion, censorship and lies are not to be trusted in any way, shape or form.

      2. The thing is, if an “expert” told you to get jabbed every two months, you would.
        Much the same as jumping off a cliff.
        Idiot.

  15. When big pharma owns the medical establishment “experts,” the media and the politicians, all bets are off.

    1. Yup….same goes for climate change “experts” and as the United Nations Under-Secretary-General for Global Communications, Melissa Ruth Fleming said they “own the science”.

      1. “Yup….same goes for climate change “experts”

        Absolutely. And the LGBTQI2+WTF people, too.

  16. “Stevie”
    He fails to recognize that the people are, in fact, listening to what the experts have to say.
    I myself, for example, listened to the spike protien manufacturer who stated that they attenuated the furin cleavage site but there were others that they did not as yet understand. I listened to Phiser when they told me that 8% (1 out of every 13) of the test group had covid symptoms after their therapeutic treatment while only one of the subjects actually tested positive for Covid-19.
    This means that one in every 13 or so “vaccine” recipients will have spike proteins being manufactured in inappropriate areas of their bodies causing inflammation and thrombotic events because the protein was not fully understood and therefore not adequately attenuated in the first place. THAT’S what the experts say “Stevie.” Now foad.

    1. Looks like the bell drove her insane and she says inane things about experts.

      Stick to the bell fatso.

  17. I guess by that logic one needn’t ever go to a doctor for a second opinion. A whole lot of stupid in there to unpack but the stick in the eye for me was “…a couple of discredited doctors make a video that says B is correct…” which begs the question how it is that the doctors suddenly became “discredited” and who exactly makes that determination?
    With the help of our MSM it almost became a case of those with the biggest bullhorns winning…thankfully the internet prevailed which is why most countries went full Nazi trying to shut them down.
    However to his or her point – Just yesterday I witnessed a video of a female TV critic/journalist arguing with an epidemiologist who cast doubt on the efficacy of masks.
    I guess she thought she was being clever when she asked the doctor “Condoms work so why are you saying masks don’t”?
    SMH. Oh Lord take me now.

  18. The FIRST litmus test for me is always … common sense. When I am told this virus is SO highly transmittable … even when you might be carrying it with NO symptoms … I start looking at when and where the virus is destroying people with the advertised abandon. So I looked at my local grocery store clerks. They are touching thousands of products that have been touched by the universally unclean … and standing in close contact with hundreds of people every day. And they have break rooms they share with the unclean.

    But I noticed a funny thing … NONE of my local clerks were dropping like flies. None. In fact … almost NOBODY in my town of 35,000 people have contracted the dreaded virus. How is that possible!? What with “the experts” told us?

    This virus was weaponized in a ChiCom lab, and every reaction to it was weaponized to spread fear and loathing ( of your fellow man). And what was the absolute ZENITH of COVID idiocy for me? Christmas 2020 … when my very highly educated son and his PhD graduate in microbiology partner refused to meet us unless it was outdoors, masked, and separated by 20ft. What an absurd spectacle that was. The virus AND especially our governments reaction to it … and all the so-called experts reaction to it … was weaponized against the people. And even now … THREE YEARS LATER … Bidinh is still claiming “Emergency” Powers to loot the American Treasury. And this douche’bag is calling every independent thinker … a “bad citizen” … and prime candidate for MAID … since COVID didn’t eliminate every last Trump voter.

  19. “For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled”

    Richard Feynman, summing it all up on the Challenger Spacecraft disaster. I’d like to know his opinion on what’s transpired over the past 3 years of chinese flu, but I suspect it largely mirrors the above statement.

    At no point does nature or science care what epidemiologists agree on.

  20. ” … could live on surfaces for up to 2 weeks”

    Could, could, could. Sure. Like your nasal passages. That’s a surface.

    Just like the beer I’m drinking now “could” give a lite-sipping metrosexual the shits.

    And an asteroid could hit the earth tonight, so best wear your hard-hat to bed.

  21. Never “Follow the Experts.” They are Human. They are Fallible.

    Follow the Data. Follow the Facts.
    Then Question the Data and Question the Facts. Because sometimes those facts you are told are not really true facts.

    Finally? How can you detect the falsehoods, the lies, and ulterior motives? Follow the Money. Follow the Prizes. Follow the Praise and Laudatory Pronouncements by the Corporate Establishment, Government Establishment, and the Mainstream Media. They are most likely lies from beginning to end.

    Be Skeptical. Be Cynical. Lately, the difference between a conspiracy theory and the truth is 2 weeks to 2 years.

  22. The “expersts” say mRNA is safe and effective.
    Moderna has more mRNA than Pfizer.
    The “experts” say we should have our vax “updated” every 2-3 months.
    And yet the slaves to “experts” here refuse to say if they have indeed follow their “expert” advice, and furthermore don’t seem to be recommending a 4-6-time/year shot, even if the “experts” they claim to champion say so.
    Its rare to see such levels of cognitive dissonance.
    I think I know who the victims of those ancient “dancing diseases” were.

  23. “Respect muh authority..I am expert!”
    The need to believe,trumps common sense,which is actually “Uncommon sense”.
    We have 100s of years of folklore and cautionary tales of real history,all of which harp upon the gullibility of man.
    For we be herd beasts with a pattern seeking mind.
    And “oh the patterns we ‘see'”.
    The dam is collapsing,we will hear even more such demands that we acknowledge the awesomeness of our credentialed helpers..who meant well,even as they slaughtered the old and sick in enormous numbers..
    Crippled the young and healthy and reduced reproductive ability across the population..
    And now we learn,in many regions,less than 10% of these drug pushers,took the government goo themselves..

    Justice will be public injection of the “best of the toxin” for all who demanded others to take it.
    1 jab for every injury ,3 for each death.
    A line was crossed during Dread Covid Theatre.
    There is no “normal” to return to.
    We have seen the enemy,they strut amongst us.
    At our expense.

  24. I worked with scientists, biologists and foresters for years. When data was scant, ‘expert’ opinion was used for regulation and policy implementation. When data was eventually there, it more often than not showed that expert opinion had been wrong.

  25. Stevie Berryman, like all his/her?, ilk is a believer in scientism not science. Scientism has become the central belief system of the over-educated.

    1. Over-educated in non-sciences, certainly.

      I started out my career in chemical engineering before switching to software engineering, and one of the things that struck me after the switch was how completely ignorant of basic science most of the programmers I met were – despite nearly all of them having university degrees that required at least four years of high school science to get into. And yet all of them were much, much more confident in their opinions about any reported science news than most of the actual engineers I know (I know, I know, Dunning-Kruger Effect).

      One of them shrieked at me about masking and tried to use “a published scientific study” to prove it. When I pointed out that the “study” was an publishing review[1], not even a meta-analysis, and all it said was “lots of papers have been published about the effectiveness of masks”, he blocked me.

      [1] Basically a summary of what papers have been published in a selected set of journals

    1. The only upside this food scam is that the stupidest people in our society will be leaving the planet much sooner than expected. Same as those who line up for the vaccines like turkeys at Thanksgiving …. The down side is that before they die, they will use up tons of healthcare services and dollars.

      The depopulation plan is a wide and varied thing. Watch for more life shortening suggestions from your government.

      They should have a blanket label for all these insane evil ideas … How about … The Anti Aging Plan. No one will get old … we will all die young.

  26. There’s some topics when the experts should definitely be believed. When astronmers predict the trajectory of a asteroid, they are on very solid ground. Even if the asteroid isn’t. Hopefully.

    And there are some topics where their opinions should be taken with a huge grain of salt; dietary science is a fine example.

    But even in the latter cases, Berryman is not far off the mark. It’s not that the experts are always right, but that their opinions are a better bet than the non-expert. If I had to put money down, it would be on the latest and greatest research, not on the guy with a blog and an attitude.

    1. …but when an untested vaccine rolled out under an “emergency” is declared “safe and effective”, before any clinical evidence even exists, everybody should fall in line. You should be ashamed of yourself.
      The rest of the planet is calling for deep investigations into vax related fatalities, you, on the other hand, are not.
      Every single person I know who got the shots now regret them, even if it was just one shot, and they are scared, and with good reason, they don’t want to join the ranks of the “dead by unknown causes” that has become one of the largest killers in Canada, and indeed, around the world.
      You and your ilk can squirm all you like, justice will find you sooner or later.

      1. “justice will find you sooner or later.”

        Have a lot of fantasies of punishing those who disagree with you, do you?

    2. We are listening to experts– just not the same ones. I challenge anyone to claim that Dr. Malone or Tess Lawrie are not experts. They are simply not pharma- paid experts.

      1. There will always be outliers and skeptics even among the experts. It will never be completely unanimous. This is on the whole a good thing.

        But when those skeptics are outnumbered a hundred to one, the smart money is on the strong majority being closer to the mark.

        1. I have seen way too many missteps coming from the ” official narrative” side. In addition, there is the refusal to acknowledge and investigate known phenomenon, such as ” died suddenly” or the significant increase In all cause mortality. There is the bizarre effort to get small children vaxed. Recommending this to pregnant women when there had been no testing involving pregnant women. Increasingly the ” official narrative ” does not make sense. So — my money is on the outliers, who at least make intelligent arguments.

        2. “But when those skeptics are outnumbered a hundred to one, the smart money is on the strong majority being closer to the mark.

          No. Especially when many, if not all, of said majority of “experts” have a vested interest in maintaining the charade. See not only Covid, but Globull Warming.

          As I noted above, science is not decided by a show of hands.

          1. The vaccine skeptics have nothing better, and in general are far, far worse. Modern medicine has produced miracles, increasing life expectancies and improving quality of life remarkably. And yet, when it suits you, you dismiss them as corrupt.

            Garbage. I am a (nonmedical) researcher and I’ve worked with researchers, and they are not so easily bought off. Most are brutally honest, even with their own ideas.

        3. “But when those skeptics are outnumbered a hundred to one, the smart money…”

          …is on the fix being in with the authorities.

          You know as well as I do you never get 100/1 splits on anything the least bit controversial. When you see public figures lining up behind an -experimental- gene therapy, and you see the whole Canadian medical profession shutting up in unison because they fear losing their medical licenses if they say anything, that more than anything else should be ringing your alarm bells.

          Not to mention, Kate at this very blog has been documenting the Canadian medical data shenanigans the whole time. Just search by the “safe and effective” tag and find hundreds of examples both large and small of rubber science with rubber data from all kinds of places.

        4. “Horseshit.

          Science is not decided by a show of hands.”

          No, that’s politics. Some people seem to repeatedly confuse those two things, don’t they?

        5. “But when those skeptics are outnumbered a hundred to one, the smart money is on the strong majority being closer to the mark.”

          No. “Follow the money” is what smart people do.

    3. That would normally be the best course of action, but the smell of corruption of the science by big (huge) pharma money is everywhere, and doctors are no more immune that the average human to the lure of riches.

  27. If we listened to the “experts” throughout history we would still be telling everyone the sun revolved around the earth (dispelled thanks to Copernicus) and anyone who soiled west of Europe would drop off the earth (dispelled thanks to Columbus).
    Unfortunately the only cure for stupidity is evolution and its not happening fast enough!!

    1. The question is not whether the experts are always right. I’m not sure ANY scientific theory is “right” in an absolute sense.

      The question is whether the experts’ opinions are likely to be better than the non-experts. On the whole, the answer is yes. More credence should be given to the expert’s opinion than the non-expert.

      1. Oh please. Obviously those challenging vaccine effectiveness and safety are listening to experts. There are many. Ultimately it becomes a question of who seems most credible. Too many of the pronouncements coming from bureaucrats and many public health people make no sense at all– like Tam’s claim about how many lives were saved by the vaccine. Totslly nuts, so I am not inclined to believe her in other areas.

        1. I’ve spent many, many hours debating vaccine skeptics. A striking theme is their inability to cite credible scientific papers to support their position. Their evidence is on the whole poor.

          1. Only those that produce the desired results receive funding ask Tony Fauci. Before Covid many studies couldn’t find a connection of wearing masks and the reduction of influence infections. After covid every study did even those that didn’t had a control group but somehow insisted they found evidence.

          2. Re: ” Inability to cite credible scientific papers”. Undoubtedly you prefer to believe the ” fact checkers” version of things. Now that is naive.

          3. Yeti:

            Paranoia is not an argument. Fauci was not so powerful that he could control the funding and results of every medical studies. There have been well over 100,000 research papers done on COVID — way beyond the control of anyone.

            People are quick to assume that researchers can be bought off, but that is not the case. Most are brutally honest to a fault,

      2. Not all scientific issues are created equal. Providing that the subject is uncontroversial, not subject to political interference, and does not have big money riding on it, sure, credit the “vast majority of scientists”. On the other hand, where scientific opinions are reigned in by financial coercion, career limiting peer pressure and even threats of physical violence, one might want to reserve judgment on the opinions of alleged experts. Remember that a good portion of peer reviewed science is non-replicable.

      3. The thing is what if the experts never had been right?
        https://statmodeling.stat.columbia.edu/2020/05/08/so-the-real-scandal-is-why-did-anyone-ever-listen-to-this-guy/

        What would one do if somebody brings their car to a shop to fix a fault and the problem never gets solved but cost lots of money and the technician rather than using original manufactures parts insists to use contraptions of his own invention that damages the car even more. Who here would continue to bring their car to that shop?

      4. “I’m not sure ANY scientific theory is “right” in an absolute sense.

        That’s why they’re called theories. Because they are not immutable. As opposed to laws, which are. See “gravity”.

  28. This appeal to authority kind of collapsed with global warming. First it was the PhDs – if you have a PhD you’re right and if you don’t your opinion doesn’t matter. Then it was the “only climate scientists with PhDs”. Then when people like Dr. Richard Lindzen (atmospheric physicist) and Dr. John Christy (climate scientist) starting questioning the science, it was “the consensus” which usually means the government. And we should all believe the government because what is the government – the people.

  29. The reason this isn’t true is simple, most experts are leftists. That makes their judgement and opinions unsound.

    This is also why elites figure they need to re-do the results of elections, to fit their bias, just in case the rabble get things wrong for them.

    I do trust experts in things like brain surgery and nuclear physics. Some specialties are so complex that their experts have no free time to become politically indoctrinated. So we’re safe to follow them. But in subjects that are not so complex, we need to be on our guard at all times, because the role of the expert is to make the narrative fit the politics of globalism. Any narrative that fails to do so (basically what most sensible people think) is “false information” and only the likes of Trump, you and me would accept it. In fact “false information” is a very good indicator of true information and vice versa. Orwell had this all worked out in 1948 (which he called 1984, I think you can see why).

  30. The argument that the average person cannot evaluate data and make decisions is an argument against democracy. Stevie may not be expert enough to understand that, but the end goal of that line of thinking is to eliminate the average person from the process of selecting government. Experts have no reason to respect rights, only people who can throw out underperforming leaders are capable of requiring that.

    1. Of course. You are too stupid, too uninformed, too emotional to be allowed any say in the matter. This is all much too complicated for you.

      You are meant to shut up and let The Experts decide how you will live. And if you complain, someone will be along to “reset” you back into your little box.

  31. Democracy is not a right, its a skill best handled by the experts?.. Yet we allow people without a clue to vote.. That’s because in politics repercussions are rare.. What we are talking about here is different.. It was democracy turned on its head.. The clueless experts best guess was wrong.. They screwed us all over and the fact that they were experts demands investigation and repercussions..

    We didn’t exactly vote ourselves into this mess.. It was imposed.. Sorry I was wrong is a excuse for a bad politician.. Not lockdowns and vaccine mandates by so called experts with no track record, true.. Everything failed because it was all for nothing.. Nobody was saved outside of a computer model, spit.. Many were doomed because of the lockdowns and experimental mRNA vaccine, spit again..

    This isn’t a Philosophy class.. Its a crime scene.. Its called professional malpractice..

  32. Alright.

    When “experts” who don’t work in the field are shown to be consistently wrong by those who DO work in the field and substantiate their claims with evidence, are they still “experts”?

    Or are they “experts” because a craven government says so?

  33. i do think the average person’s judgement is fine, especially for them. I was gung-ho for a vaccine when they first came out, and the information was universally bad with no data to judge. Due to the Trudeau government’s bungling, the vaccine was delayed long enough for me to look at raw data, and yes, anecdotal as well. I could see that covid was a disease for the old and sick, and that the vaccines carried risk. I decided not to get one. That cost me, personally and professionally.

    Over the holidays, I got covid. I am now over covid, no worse for wear, because I am young enough and take very good care of myself. I’m not a doctor, but I am able to make informed judgments, mine turned out to be right, for me. A vaccine would have exposed me to completely unnecessary risk.

    To all who cancelled, threatened and tried to cajole me, I will not forget, and I will not forgive.

  34. I get excited whenever I see discussions here that extend to 100+ comments.
    Then I feel a little deflated when I look and realize that 40% of them are essentially spam posts from a “true believer” in the mainstream narrative.

  35. Genuinely smart people look for answers from people smarter than themselves? So who am I supposed to ask?

    Seriously. My IQ is somewhere north of 190. There’s maybe 100 people in the world like me. Who am I supposed to ask? Because the “experts”, aren’t.

  36. “Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts” – Richard Feynman

    “The expert” “Aristotle wrote that heavy objects fell more rapidly. Europeans believed him for two thousand years.” Benjamin Crowell

  37. This is the classic “argument from authority” which can be restated in this case as “You can’t handle the truth!”

    I am not an epidemiologist, I don’t know all there is to know about viruses and how they propagate in a population. But I can read the fact sheet in a box of masks, and I know how big a WuFlu virus is, so I know that the procedure masks they’ve been foisting upon us are the same as using a picket fence to keep out mosquitoes. I also know the difference between droplet and aerosol transmission, so I know that nothing short of a plastic suit and remote air supply is going to keep me from catching it.

    Therefore when I see the “experts” -lying- about stuff I know, I’m forced to wonder what else they’re lying about that I don’t know. Maybe everything?

  38. Im careful not to offer advice in matters of love or finance.. If pressed on matters of health I will say follow doctors orders.. Life is a minefield and you could be eating a pizza with that cheating whore of yours next week and I’m out in the cold..

    People don’t want to hear advice.. They want their own decisions confirmed.. Or at the very lest make sure they are not out in the cold..
    I work with a guy who lost both his dad and his brother to health reasons not related to covid 19.. He is a diabetic who is under doctors orders to get the shot.. He knows and he is scared and he directly asked me.. I said follow your doctors orders.. What do I know..

    Im not sure if he was testing me or confiding in me.. What a world we live in where Im not sure that a man who lost both his brother and his dad is more concerned about my vaccine status than his own health.. Good job government, good job..

  39. 1. Follow the money.
    2. Who accepted accountability ?
    3. Two weeks for a ‘curve’.
    4. My body, my choice.
    5. No reports of burial pits for the ‘millions’ who died.
    6. 98 per cent survival rate for my age group.
    7. Next week’s panic is more important than all previous annoucements from Henny Penny.

  40. I just realized you may have misgendered this person. Stevie may not be a she. In fact how do you even know what a woman is? Are you a biologist?

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