"Organic" Is The Latin Word For "Grown In Pig Shit"

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Eat organic, kill the planet

Organic farming is sold as good for the environment. This is correct for a single farm field: organic farming uses less energy, emits less greenhouse gasses, nitrous oxide and ammonia and causes less nitrogen leeching than a conventional field. But each organic field yields much, much less. So, to grow the same amount of wheat, spinach or strawberries, you need much more land. That means that average organic produce results in the emission of about as many greenhouse gasses as conventional produce; and about 10 per cent more nitrous oxide, ammonia and acidification. Worse, to produce equivalent quantities, organic farms need to occupy 84 per cent more land - land which can't be used for forests and genuine nature reserves. For example, to produce the amount of food America does today, but organically, would require increasing its farmland by the size of almost two United Kingdoms. That is the equivalent of eradicating all parklands and wild lands in the lower 48 states.


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Not to mention...
Organic is similar to avoiding vaccines. Unprotected children benefit from the fact that they are surrounded by protected children. Same for crops.

A field of (say)organic potatoes is protected from late bight because the fields around are sprayed with prophylactic fungicides to ward of the highly destructive LB fungus. If no one sprayed, in years where conditions are right (warm with high humidity), then there would be a complete loss of the potato crop. LB does not just reduce yields by a few percent. Left unchecked, a healthy field is defoliated within 3 weeks and the tubers underground reduced to stinking mush as well. 100% loss. No crop.

The eco crowd that protest against conventional farming (including pesticides and GMOs) are promoting ineffective agriculture that has no means of feeding 7 billion people. It is all well and fine for some small-farm weenies to claim to be producing organic, GMO-free crops, but the cost per unit is high and the arable land is wasted as noted in the article.

In human health we call chemicals "medicine," however, in agriculture we call chemicals "pesticides." It is an unfortunate term. "Crop-protection products" is more appropriate. Antibiotics are pesticides. Anti-inflammatory drugs are growth regulators..like some herbicides.

Those goddamn A&W ads promoting antibiotic-free and hormone-free are a disgrace aimed at the millennial demographic who will be the ruination of mankind. Wussy idiots more concerned about the next iPhone or iPad model.

Chemicals are a part of human, animal and crop health.

BTW, for fun, Google the MSDS for caffeine. "Do not ingest." HA AH! Such chemophobia.

Clive
PS: "... organic farms need to occupy 84 per cent more land " I think this is a bit exaggerated. Yields typically are reduced a few percent to about half of conventional. No matter, the concept is correct: organic is not environmentally friendly.

I have friends who have adopted this religion thanks to a chiropractor who peddles vitamins to his flock and preaches all chemicals are bad for you.

A 52 year old follower with a heart condition was told to discontinue his medication. His doctor was quite upset with him. He is now pushing up daisies. His family is running an aggressive campaign to inform the public with little effect. Similar to the recent trial in Alberta. Tough to get them off the cool aid.

I suspect the articles is incorrect for one reason. Much of organic farming certification a fraud?

More food, less quality. There's no free ride. And glyphosate is a mineral chelator sometimes causing the 'yellow flash' symptoms where it binds with manganese and makes it unavailable to the plant. One could expect magnesium to be similarly affected.

Curiously more than 50% of the population are deficient in magnesium.

Sigh again. ALL food is organic. Especially if sold on TV by some gal with big tits and no brain. HGTV and others come to mind.

The power of the mind to believe something is better for you even when it's based on junk science. The only difference between snake oil salesmen of the past and the current crop is,....today's snake oil salesmen are licensed.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/henrymiller/2015/07/29/why-organic-agriculture-is-a-colossal-hoax/#41e16bb538e4

Well DAMN. That means virtually everything grown in China is certified "organic" - Good for them!!

Check your math CAS. If yields are reduced a few percent up to half, then space required could be up to 100% more.

"Curiously more than 50% of the population are deficient in magnesium"
Reputable medical sites list hypomagnesemia as a 'rare' disorder with rare defined as less than 200000 Americans with the problem.
Don't believe everything Dr.Oz tells you.

Mecheng, please don't get me wrong (which I believe you have done), "organic" is utter nonsense and is no way to feed the world and is environmentally hostile considering the inefficient use of land. On that we agree.

"If yields are reduced a few percent up to half, then space required could be up to 100% more." The problem with your phrase is that double the land is required ONLY for crops where yield is one half. But that is the exception according to the USDA data. (And BTW, I did a major consulting project for the greenhouse industry five years ago including an assessment of organic as a production and marketing option. I had to study yield losses quite extensively.)

Back to the math. If organic yields are (say) 20% lower, then about 25% more land is required than for conventional. If yields are one half, THEN double the land is required. But the average is in between and
this article claims "organic farms need to occupy 84 per." I think that is an exaggeration. The USDA data suggest that is an exaggeration.

Go to Genetic Literacy Project and search "USDA data on 370 crops: Why organic farming has lower yields" to get an idea of organic yields compared to conventional.

If you look at the organic production figures you can see they are indeed lower. BUT if we tried to be 100% organic, I suspect yields would plummet to well lower than current organic yields because diseases and pests could become major problems. Potato production would be severely compromised and huge production areas would be out of business fast.

As I started saying in my first post, organic producers are protected because they are surrounded by conventional production which keeps outbreaks to a minimum. Just like the school kiddies who are not vaccinated...they are protected by the masses around them that are vaccinated.

Anyway, organic is immoral IMHO. It is environmentally unfriendly and unsustainable.

And when will we see the first alarmist report claiming that the world’s kelp beds are in danger because they are over-harvested for organic fertilizer? Might happen....you just won’t see that on the CBC. ☺

Funny this. Live in s small town most ly zoned agricultural where the corporate chicken farms are being slapped up to house 5, 10, 15 thousand chickens at a time. All i hear constantly from residents is how bad the flies are.
Hello?.
Organic? Means no or not enough chemicals (that actually work to kill things)

What is that word? Shaudenfreude?
You wanted this. Instead they blame farmers.

All of the comments may be true to some extent for industrial 'organic' farming.

I grow a mixed vegetable garden with all natural fertilizers and no pesticides or other agricultural chemicals. I don't get problems with 'pests'. A healthy garden is like a healthy body and doesn't need drugs and chemicals. As compared with others who use chemical fertilizers and pesticides, I get much better crop yields and the vegetables taste much better.

Mono-crop industrial agriculture is problematic whether it's 'organic' or not.

I couldn't care less about 'feeding the world'. If people in some regions let their populations grow out of control so that their land can't feed and sustain them, then "tough shít"; some of them are gonna die. It's not my responsibility.

"Adapt or Die" is the oldest 'law' on the planet.

"For example, to produce the amount of food America does today, but organically, would require increasing its farmland by the size of almost two United Kingdoms. That is the equivalent of eradicating all parklands and wild lands in the lower 48 states."

Let's not forget all the farmland presently dedicated to corn for ethanol production, which needn't be organic corn because it isn't consumed as food.(assuming corn produced for ethanol production isn't counted as food crops, which would be a trusted assumption which ignores the kind of record keeping that the Left practices. The Left has zero problem with false duel figuring-*counting twice*- as the roll up to ObamaCare has shown)

Almost all diabetics, Type 1 and type 2, are deficient in magnesium. As are those classed as pre-diabetic. That's over 50% of the population.

https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Magnesium-HealthProfessional/

Examination Survey (NHANES) of 2005–2006 found that a majority of Americans of all ages ingest less magnesium from food than their respective EARs;

Habitually low intakes of magnesium induce changes in biochemical pathways that can increase the risk of illness over time.

Yes, yes! But please answer my question: are you sayin' I'm better to eat Bambi that was feedin' on non-organic soybeans than Bambi that was eatin' the ones grown in pigshit?

From your link:
"Symptomatic magnesium deficiency due to low dietary intake in otherwise-healthy people is uncommon because the kidneys limit urinary excretion of this mineral [3]. However, habitually low intakes or excessive losses of magnesium due to certain health conditions, chronic alcoholism, and/or the use of certain medications can lead to magnesium deficiency"
The thing about the alternative health supplement industry is that they don't give you the full story or a true evaluation of the statistics; for example the difference between prevalence and incidence.

If you like good military sci-fi,John Ringo's Last Centurion has a section just eviscerating "organic" farming vs. industrial farming. :)

The thing about the alternative health supplement industry is that they don't give you the full story or a true evaluation of the statistics; for example the difference between prevalence and incidence.

The thing about the so-called 'experts' is, they don't either.

"Symptomatic magnesium deficiency due to low dietary intake in otherwise-healthy people is uncommon because the kidneys limit urinary excretion of this mineral [3].

Yes, except for over half the population who are either pre-diabetic or diabetic. I guess they wouldn't be considered 'healthy'.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertglatter/2015/09/08/50-percent-of-adults-in-u-s-have-diabetes-or-pre-diabetes-study-finds/#18de376816f4

Half Of Adults In The U.S. Have Diabetes Or Pre-Diabetes, Study Finds

http://www.endocrineweb.com/professional/type-2-diabetes/lowering-risk-type-2-diabetes

“In contrast to other micronutrients, relatively little attention is given to adequate magnesium as an important part of a healthy diet." she said. "In fact, we know from national surveys, as well as in our own research populations, that somewhere between 50% and 75% of Americans have inadequate magnesium intake. When compared to a similar mineral, like calcium, which many Americans get more than enough of, the low magnesium intake presents a striking contrast."

Low magnesium levels were reported by approximately half of women and 75% of men in the study. After 7-years of follow-up, participants with the highest intake of magnesium had a 37% lower risk of developing metabolic impairment (P for trend =0.02). Among participants who already had metabolic impairment at baseline, higher intake of magnesium was linked to a 32% lower risk of new-onset diabetes (P=0.05).

So, as we began, is glyphosate chelating the minerals and making it unavailable to the plants? Since it's a known problem with manganese, we can assume other minerals are involved as well.

Half Of Adults In The U.S. Have Diabetes Or Pre-Diabetes ...and are generally obese. It's self inflicted morbidity, largely due to stupidity and lack of self control.

"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." George Carlin

More than half of the people in North America are overweight to obese, eat mostly processed 'food' laced with chemicals that do not exist in the natural environment, are sick with diabetes, cancer and other debilitating ailments, and are generally below average intelligence. The patterns are obvious to anyone who can 'connect the dots'.

Leftist elitism on full display...

they don't really mean organic because all foods no matter how they are grown are organic. What they really mean is no pesticides were used. Of course if not for modern means of producing food billions would starve. Maybe that is the plan.

I note that your links are part of the industry that provides an alternative approach to health and if that works for you, well great. Myself, I'll be giving magnesium supplements a pass since hypermagnesemia(too much magnesium) can cause renal failure.
I do like your idea of promoting the concept of pre-diabetes. I will be using that approach with my banker when we talk about the debt I have to service. I'm going to tell him I have pre-wealth syndrome and if he waits for a time, real wealth for me will appear just around the corner.

Sigh. I don't even know how to begin addressing this argument, but I'll try by relating my own experiences with organics. Because the issue is important.

I was born with Crohn's Disease 64 years ago. Anybody who knows anything about Crohn's Disease will tell you that I've already beaten my life expectancy and that by now, after a lifetime of the steroid-and-surgery carousel, statistically I should be wearing a colostomy bag. And that could still happen; I'm making no miracle claims for organic foods. But in the forty plus years that I've been a strict organic vegetarian, I've only lost my gall bladder.

Do organics cost more? Sure. Double or more over a lifetime. My wife and I aren't well off, and we've had to scrimp and save in other areas to prioritize. Do they "harm the environment"? Uh, no. That's a ridiculous claim and unsupported by any scientific evidence. Would mandating them necessitate turning all of America's parkland into farmland? Well, again no; converting the giant robot farms of agribusiness to all organics wouldn't cause much expansion, especially if we stop taxpayer subsidizing of nutritionally useless grains like corn and stocking huge surpluses that we ship overseas for free to rot in warlords' compounds. However, I'm opposed to government mandates of any kind (including insurance)--those who don't want to eat organics certainly shouldn't have to. And I view with the greatest skepticism any claims of the big food companies(and they now own most of the "natural" food business)to being organic. All you can do when you have no other choice is to hope that at the very least you aren't buying GMO.

Let me add as an aside that without GMO crops, we couldn't possibly support our present world population. In fact half of India would have died over the years if not for the gene-modified hybrid crops introduced there since the 1960s. However, I wouldn't want to eat them myself. They really are scary, and worse, they taste like ass.

Because, ultimately, eating choices are as much a matter of taste as health. After 40 years on this strict diet I can promise you one thing with absolute certainty: I can tell the difference between organic and non-organic food after one bite (obviously not meat, since I haven't had any since the Jurassic.) Organic tastes better. Period. And you are what you eat.

Reducing yield to about half conventional means you need 100% more land for the same yield, not just 84%.

Heh, renal failure can cause hypermagnesemia, not the other way around.

And pre-diabetes has a recognized medical definition.

There are about 30 million acres farmers are being paid not to farm under the USDA program. 50,000 sq. miles

Yes, but the ones who would die would be overwhelmingly brown-skinned, so, I guess it doesn't matter.

Organic does not mean NO pesticides. There are some allowed, pyrethrins (derived from chrysanthemums) are an example.

I think the strongest component of this argument is the banning of chemical pesticides
(Especially DDT). I first read this statistic in Dr. Dixie Lee Ray's book Trashing The
Planet. Sri Lanka started using DDT and experienced a 50 percent increase in crop yields.
That is a huge deal unto itself, but over time, they saw new Malaria rates plummeting from just
under a quarter million a year to something like 17.

It was P.J. O'Rourke who remarked that it was amazing to see results like this in a tropical
shit-hole like Sri Lanka.

Not one person on Earth has suffered any ill effect from chemical pesticides, food colorings,
preservatives, etc., yet these neo-Luddite morons keep up the drumbeat! The usual suspects
then pumped several hundred times as much DDT into seabirds and discovered that their eggs
were .1 mm (or somesuch number) thinner. Well, Dr. Ray wondered why nobody thought to study
whether DDT exposure made the seabirds healthier by killing mites, mosquitoes, fleas, etc?

I would just like to point out one other consequence of needing more land to produce the same yield. That also means more water is needed. See 'California drought'.

Not one person on Earth has suffered any ill effect from chemical pesticides, food colorings, preservatives, etc.

Since you presumably ingest large quantities of chemical pesticides, food coloring, preservatives, etc., you've just disproved your argument with an excellent example of cognitive impairment. By all means keep up the practice as it will get you out of the health care queue faster and make room for people who can be healed. I would never suggest that a person's right to kill themselves prematurely by any means they choose should be in any way inhibited.

Have a nice day.

You are quite correct. Every study that examines the amount of ag-chem residue in fruits and vegetables has shown significantly lower levels in produce labelled 'organic'. Organic produce tastes much better in my experience as well. I've noticed that those who deny the validity of organic food are often smokers as well, so it's not at all surprising that they wouldn't be able to taste the difference. It's also quite telling that they seem to believe they're being forced to eat organic food and that the free choice of people who do prefer organic food should somehow be stopped. It simply proves that those who seek to control the lives of others are almost always unable to control their own lives. The people who prefer organic food don't believe that the right of free choice in what anyone eats should be restricted. Almost all believe that people should be free to poison themselves by any means they choose as quickly as they want to.

"nutritionally useless grains like corn"
Can't make Bourbon without it. Cold dead hands.

You make some excellent points, but I think you went off the rails on antibiotic-free.

Widespread antibiotic use in food production is probably the major factor selecting for antibiotic-resistant bacteria, much bigger than medical misuse. It was an accidental discovery that adding antibiotics encouraged faster growth of meat animals and we still do not know the mechanism of action.

While I'm pretty militantly pro-GMO (I did PR for one of the last agbiotech companies) and have been an CAGW skeptic since 1991, I think the evidence for taking antibiotic supplements out of healthy animals strongly suggests that it will be good for the future of antibiotic medicine and for human microbiomes.


You are correct. Approximately 80% of N.American antibiotics are used in agriculture as feed additives. It's proven that it creates antibiotic resistant 'superbugs'. The significant increase in 'superbug' infections surrounding every CAFO is well documented. Unfortunately the pharmaceutical lobby is strong and well funded enough to overrule common sense.

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I grew up on a farm in the 50's and 60's and many fruits and foods do not taste as good now, or as good as my garden is. The difference is not being non-organic. When dad stopped keeping cows and we no longer used manure the tomatoes did not taste less. The difference is how you get the food to market. I have picked tomatoes for market and they were only slightly red when picked. They were ripened on the way to market. Same with strawberries. My uncle had developed the best tasting cantelope/muskmelon ever, but it would only last 3 days so no shelf life.
I look forward to my garden tomatoes grown in some % of chicken manure but am glad I can enjoy less tasty tomatoes all year round. My diet is so much more diverse and healthy than my parents in their youth had, even those who had money.

CAS, I shit you not! I used to work in an industrial trade. Inside the shit houses at the
Southern California Northrop facilities, they placed MSDS stickers on all the soap dispensers.
The height of government regulatory insanity is written on the MSDS sheet;

Do not ingest.

Health Hazards: None if used properly.

Caution: Avoid contact with eyes.

Etc.

Yes, we have the nanny state forcing businesses to expend millions of dollars worth of paperwork and
lost productivity to teach us the same lesson that every mother taught their children at 3 years of
age!

PS If Caffeine harmful, I would have been dead DECADES ago!


I use composted sheep manure in my garden, and bone meal from moose, caribou and bison bones I run through the chipper/shredder. The vegetables taste much better than those grown in local gardens using chemical fertilizers. Not just my opinion, but verified by others.

I read that the Nazis were big into Organics not to mention hitler was a vegan and the nazis were into animal rights as well Yeah hitler would have gotten along with the eco-freaks and back to nature weirdos the naqzis were also into rewilding most of mainland europe as well as North and South america THE NAZIS WERE GREEN

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