We Don't Need No Stinking Giant Fans

Don't pay the least bit of attention to boring old politics. Ignore current affairs.
Expect more of the same.

Applies to any group led by any other group. No one is immune.

Although the headline isn't tough enough (it chooses), the question is actually self-answering: all of the above.

So, in that hour (Scott's reference should be to megawatt hours, not megawatts -- which highlights the problem of media illiteracy on certain public sector policy problems that involve, er, numbers -- energy, the difference between debt and deficit (which floors me every time I hear them make that mistake), public sector compensation, privatization, etc.), Ontario electricity ratepayers were forced to subsidize wind energy producers by:

1,456 mWh * ($135/mWh wind - $16.50/mWh market) =

$172,536

plus, by the way, 13% HST, the 8% provincial portion of which is a tax increase, which McGuinty said in three elections in a row he wouldn't do.

A simpler way to frame the question might be:

"Is McGuinty an ‘unmitigated disaster’ or just plain embarrassing?"

Also self-answering, except for people like Thomas "Are you smarter than a fourth grader?" Mulcair, who think that Stephen Harper and Western Canada are to blame for the decline in Ontario's manufacturing sector.

(Posted just in case anyone from Western Canada thinks that none of us dumb-ass Ontarians get it).

A P.S. to my last comment: the media illiteracy disease in respect of numerically-intensive questions of public business is not confined to Ontario -- apparently, it also extends to the United States, where the media there seem to be mystified as to why people think there are problems with the MSM-published opinion polls...

But I digress, or obsess, or something.

It is both a disaster and an embarrassment. David Southam is exactly right. We have people who don't know the difference between work and power, kilo and mega, and simple arithmetic making billion dollar decisions.

I think it really does all come down to shear stupidity. There should be a basic math test required of anyone who wants to run for public office. If you asked a simple question like - if you pay 50$ a month for electricity and the price goes up 500 percent, how much will your bill be?

Well since theres no way in hell anyone will ever be able to payoff the Ontario provincial dept or any other provincial dept, just spend like a liberal and start whistling. You voted them in three times so enjoy the fun and pay up.

Priced the way most homeowners would recognize it, 1.65 cents/kwh, the amazing fact is that conventional electricity is amazingly cheap to produce! On the other hand, 13.5 cents/kwh for wind energy seems to be about average for "green" energy sources. In other words, obscenely expensive.

It's not a disaster, it's Progressive!

It couldn't possibly be embarrassing because Liberals have no shame.

If I show my old Reform Party membership can I move to Saskatchewan? Alberta has gone liberal and my home province of Ontario has gone bat-s#$% crazy, re-electing Dolton McGuinty, again.

This is the consequence of the widespread lack of fundamental math skills. We need people with business experience in charge, who have spent years budgeting, carefully balancing incoming cash against expenditures. Instead we get pandering, spend thrift lawyers in charge and no good will come of that.

It must be more than 'just' embarrassing, because I get so $#@&^%# angry when my hydro bill comes in.

Too bad we can't arrange things so that the stupidity is paid for by 'just' the arseholes who voted for The Dildo.

I live in Ontario and I pay my electricity through a third party, not a fixed price (which can be awful), but at a floating $.02 above the average monthly market price. Unfortunately everyone pays the global adjustment which is the difference between the price paid to the utlilities and the above $0.0165 spot price. Since I am with a contract, this amount is stated on the bill, about $50 for each of July and August. If you pay direct to your municipal utillity, it's hidden in the total, so most people have no idea. My bill is basically 1/3 taxes, debt repayment and other fees, 1/3 usage, and 1/3 subsidy for green crap.

None of these numbers include the cost of building back up generation for wind. And especially not the cost of cancelling Oakville and Mississauga locations to win a couple of seats. Mississauga was reported to be $180,000,000, Oakville will be more, and Mississauga total will also be more. 1/2 billion will be the bare minimum to buy an election.

GTA idiots.

"Is McGuinty’s energy strategy an ‘unmitigated disaster’ or just plain embarrassing?"

Neither. Its THEFT. Plain and simple.

David Southam did the math for me above, and it shows that the McGuinty government -stole- $176K from me in the hour mentioned and gave it to the wind generation company. For -nothing-. Start adding up hours, that gets to be a whole lot of money really quick.

Previously we have heard that the Liberal Party of Ontario and the Liberal Party of Canada have lots of "friends" in at the top of these wind generation companies. I think in future we may well find that this wind/solar generation setup is a scandal that makes AdScam look like kids shoplifting a comic book.

Saskabush dwellers, call your MPPs and let them know you are wise to the scam before the prairie starts sprouting giant fans.

For your perusal,the recently elected president of the Liberal Party of Canada.

A Toronto businessman, Crawley is president of renewable power generation company company, International Power Canada, Inc. In 2001, he founded AIM PowerGen Corporation, a wind power developer, owner and operator and was its CEO until International Power Inc. acquired it in 2009.

Well said Jamie MacMaster @ 7:32 AM.

It's dumbfounding to anyone with a thought process beyond a turnip to think even though Dalton McGuinty has put Ontario on the skids and continues towards the cliff, he won one of the two by-elections recently.

Do we need any more proof we get the government we deserve?

I think you will find David Peterson's name on many of those wind power boards as well. It is theft, pure and simple.

What’s with the halo around the minister’s head? Is he some kind of saint or alien or something?

Wind generation forcing export at a loss is common to all wind generation systems. It happens in Denmark as well, where Danish wind displaces Norwegian hydro.

Liz, yes indeed he won a by-election this month. It was in Vaughn. What's more surprising is that the Dippers won in Kitchener-Waterloo and not the Tories. That one is a thorough condemnation of how feeble Hudak has been.

Vizzy nails it again.

The more Is ee stuff like this, the more convinced I become that we don't need smarter politicians, because they'll say/do anything to get/stay in power; nor do we need smarter voters, because we're stuck with what we've got. It's too easy to buy your way in by spending money we haven't got and we won't have to worry about repaying.

We need some kind of overall protection - some clause in the Charter for the right of future generations to have "quiet enjoyment" of the society we're handing off to them someday.

"I'm afraid you can't generate that deficit,because you have not offered a reasonable plan as to how you will pay off the resulting debt, and that violates the Charter rights of all Canadians."

Will it happen? Bet it won't.

People get the government they deserve when they do not think for themselves and are swayed by the media party.

BTW, Brad's Bird Blenders at Moosemin, SK were all working last Friday and one was having a rest yesterday.

wallyj, that's what I was alluding to. Thanks!

Germany has spent + $600 billion on wind power. The theoretical capacity is almost 30% of the load. Their system is averaging 5%. The cost is so bad that industry is saying it is affecting their competiveness.

If you're stupid enough to keep voting in McGuinty and his merry band of thieves, then you deserve to feeeze in the dark.

You got what you voted for Ontario. Now suck it up, turn down the thermosat and put on a parka - Fools !

Has the term "windfare" come into existence yet? I would propose it as a form of welfare given to wind energy providers (or some days, non-providers).

Al_in_Ottawa, you're welcome to come to Saskatchewan, just make sure you leave all your nutball Eastern ideas and attitudes behind you, but being a former Reform Party member those ideas should be pretty much paper thin anyway.

We in the west read about what is going on in Ontario, re; energy, education, justice, social issues etc and just shake our heads then go back to gathering rocks to build the wall on the Manitoba border.

Having lived socialism for most of our history, most of us in Sask. know what it can do and don't want it back.

You people should be happy they are exporting it for $16.50 instead of getting nothing. Wind power, because of its unreliability, has to be fully backed up. You can't shut the nuke plant down for 15 minutes when the wind is blowing. Subsidizing wind power is beyond stupid. Time to vote in a new government. The NDP says they will straighten everything out, perhaps like last time. The Tories seem to regularly snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

Maybe everybody should be smart like the Germans and put a diesel engine in the windmills. Then during the 85 % of the time the wind isn't blowing they can still be powerplants. Not sure how that fits their renewable energy/carbon footprint plan. I suspect they think it doesn't make them look like idiots.

I would qualify doubling the cost of electricity, chasing electric-dependant indistry out of the province and rationing the consumer "an unmitigated disaster" - wouldn't you?

Only a total pencil neck geek like McGuinty could take an abundant golden egg laying goose like the provincial hydro electric grid and screw it so badly no private capital is willing to buy into it. The wind and solar programs was a complete write off that stuggling consumer will be paying off for decades.

The Phantom at September 25, 2012 8:06 AM

Right on Phantom! The whole "green energy" program is one massive boondoggle for friends of the current government. McGuinty is just ONE of the thieves across this Country stealing from the poor to pay off the rich,in the name of a "noble" cause.

In B.C., Gordon Campbell forced BC Hydro to sign contracts with private windmill operators for 18 cents/kwh,while the going rate was 6 cents/kwh!

Like all the AGW bull sh*t, it's all about stealing money from taxpayers to pay off members of the ruling elite.

It's really too bad we're too civilized to have a revolution, 1789-1799 French style. Our ruling elite deserve no less.

dmorris, you know those wind fans would make awesome guillotines. Just Krazy Glue razor blades to the leading edges of the blades.

Cdn Bacon:
Your yelling at the wrong crowd. Go over to few Liberal blogs and vent at them.
I can assure people here, with the exception of trolls, did not vote the McSquinty.

David Southam, minuteman - I agree regarding the confusion in units. I sent a comment to the Prairie Farm Report people because they rated wind turbines in kilowatts per hour. Even our intellectual betters in a West Coast think tank recently stated that the Alberta / B.C. tie-line was rated at 500 megawatts per hour.

Nothing new about any of these revelations, Ont AG repoted that between 2005-11 Ont received $1.8 B less for exported electricity than its generating cost. McGuinty's business plan is to replace cheap hydro power with very expensive wind power and export most of it at a loss to neighbouring states. In 2010 866 % of wind power was generated while Ont was already in a surplus
situation.If the MSM reported this, Ontarians would drive McGuinty from office. Then again given urban Ont's love of "green energy", maybe they wouldn't.

Cdn. Bacon: "If you're stupid enough to keep voting in McGuinty..." Blah Blah Blah.

Pi$$ off, pig jerky. As Ghost says, none of us from Ontario on this forum voted for Dalton.

Martin: "...Ontarians would drive McGuinty from office."

(sigh) I wish this was true. The problem is that too much of the deep urban constituency is terminally stupid or naive. And let's face it; too many of them don't give a rat's a$$ about economic issues. They're all hung up on things like gay rights, baby car seat standards, no smoking laws and other irrelevancies.

“The disadvantages of wind are its uncertainty, both in quantity and in time, and the difficulty with which it is regulated. In consequence of the irregularity of its force, it is impossible to employ it in labor requiring delicacy of operation: and, in consequence of its uncertainty in time, it could not be employed where the labor of many persons was dependent on its assistance.

The above quote is from Francis Wayland in: The Elements of Political Economy, written in 1838.

http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/49780