The Decline And Fall Of The American Empire

Stands to save about a -billion- dollars by having citizenship in Singapore. How many rich French guys are seeing this today and thinking "Hmmmm".

What does it say about the USA that I'm thinking this was a no-brainer on Saverin's part? And hey, that he's fleeing to COMMUNIST CHINA so he can do better as a Capitalist?

Remember in '00 and '04 when a lot of leftists said they'd leave the US if Bush was elected? I don't remember any of them following through on the promise. Yet under the explicitly non-Bush president of the leftists dreams, people are abandoning the US in unprecedented numbers.

"Renouncing citizenship is an option chosen by increasing numbers of Americans. A record 1,780 gave up their U.S. passports last year compared with 235 in 2008, according to government records."

I'm still trying to comprehend why anyone would buy Facebook stock in the first place.

If every rich American left the U.S. to avoid high taxes, there'd be much less inequality, and more social justice. Or something.

His actions do far more good than any political activism or voting. Too bad gun rights are so sucky around the world.

I've been to Singapore. I never ran into anyone called Galt and it was easy to find and get too.

I'm sorry, but if you are a BILLIONAIRE and leave because of high taxes then good riddance to you because you are truly one greedy bastard. Don't let the door hit you on the way out and don't expect to ever come back. At 35% taxation the poor bastard would only have 650 million left. My heart bleeds for this poor defector. With that kind of money one could work at changing the system but to turn your back on the country that made that kind of wealth possible and feel hard done by strikes me as the height of hippocracy. Good riddance.

"I'm sorry, but if you are a BILLIONAIRE and leave because of high taxes then good riddance to you because you are truly one greedy bastard"
you are absolutely right on. He should not only pay the tax but should feel good in knowing that many lazy, good for nothing slobs will be able to buy a big screen TV's or an ipad or an iphone. I mean , not everyone WANTS to put in the effort to succeed.Just look at the "occupy" crow for evidence of that.

I agree with peterj. Severan also looks like a serious creep. Good riddance.

Really Peter? It's OK to legislatively steal one third of a person's property because they will still have too much? This is your rationale? If this is the case why start at a billion; perhaps the threshold should be a million, or a hundred thousand. Just remember that for about 5 billion people their net worth is pretty much zero. Your logic means all of those people will eventually steal your net worth too. The real problem in the world is not that there are too many people with too much; it’s that there are too many with too little. Your politics of envy perpetuates poverty. It is an equal sharing of that poverty. Capitalism and the free market create wealth that raises everyone’s standard of living. I for one choose the latter system and would do exactly what Saverin is doing. Feeding the limitless appetite of statism and socialism has never resulted in anything positive.

@AndyN... re: "A record 1,780 gave up their U.S. passports last year compared with 235 in 2008"

I'd bet a number of those were Canadians of unintended dual citizenship renouncing their USA citizenship after finding out the IRS could come after them for unpaid taxes even though they had never lived in the USA, never worked in the USA, and never had a Social Security Number.

I think there should be a law against what he is doing........ getting out of America should be punished by jail time in a gulag sort of place.

Like really..... America should FORCE its citizens to stay and either pay up or go to jail just like some 1976 communist state........ Right Pete?

Pay his fair share........ to others.

Wait till they come for you because you made $76000 last year. Ya gotta pay!

"I'm sorry, but if you are a BILLIONAIRE and leave because of high taxes then good riddance to you because you are truly one greedy bastard"

He could stay and still profit by the $BiLLIONS without paying taxes like GE or Warren Buffet or George Soros but he'd have to make sugar kisses to the puppet Obama and his facist Masters.
Looks to me like he wants to stay a Free Agent even if it means some dolts think it's about greed instead of freedom.

Really, what point is there in being a brilliant Nouveau Riche $Billionaire if the Old Money demands you to bow and scrape at their By-Your-Leave M'Lord like their dullard pet monkey Obama does?

Might as well join all the new players with new ideas in the Orient, after all, they've got the manufacturing base plus a grab at Canada's energy products to make it all sizzle.
Yeah Baby!

Not much loss.

I'm still trying to comprehend why anyone would buy Facebook stock in the first place.

Exactly. There's no production of anything real. Another pet rock fad.

"At 35% taxation the poor bastard would only have 650 million left. My heart bleeds for this poor defector."

What happened to all that 'Citizen Of the World' shinola you Leftists always go on about ad nauseum and admire so much in Cap'n WaffleSnarfer?
Changed your tune have you?
Afraid the butcher bill for your ilk's profligate socialist spending is going to arrive sooner than you originally anticipated, eh?
tsk tsk

A fine example of re-distributing existing wealth without ever producing any new wealth.

There's a sucker born every minute...the New Circus...

Time to get working on a Pet Rock app.

You never know.

I am capitalist to the core but 35% on a BILLION leaving me 650 million is just not the same as 35% on a MILLION or any logical reason exept pure unadultrated greed to leave the country that made that kind of profit possible. If $650 million is not enough for anyone before you say thats enough and I can contribute to the country coffers or charity or a hundred other write offs then this mentality is way beyond anything to do with capitalism. This is a stand alone catagory that has nothing to do with capitalism, socialism or anything except pure greed. Don't know about the rest of you but if I had 650 million to my name I would not hand in my passport because I felt hard done by. I would be proud that the capitalistic system allowed me to get that filthy rich because I know that in a socialist system it would have never happened. Take my 35% and kiss my ash.

"I am capitalist to the core..."

Piffle.
Capitalists do not use the term 'greed' to describe someone retaining and freely enjoying the fruits of their own labor.

You sound just like Obama saying that someone has "earned enough".
How bloody dare Obama or you be the judge of when somebody else has earned enough?

He earned it, it's his and his alone.
You're no more a capitalist than my dog is.

"He earned it, it's his and his alone."
I'm sure he feels the same way. Somehow I feel sorry for you though.

He earned it, it's his and his alone.

Yeah, just like those of pet rock fame 'earned it'.

they don't even try to 'hide the decline' anymore...watch for 'bama's 'executive order' banning drilling there within the week, because a strong, self-sustaining country doesn't elect, need or want socialists.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/gao-recoverable-oil-colorado-utah-wyoming-about-equal-entire-world-s-proven-oil

(CNSNews.com) – The Green River Formation, a largely vacant area of mostly federal land that covers the territory where Colorado, Utah and Wyoming come together, contains about as much recoverable oil as all the rest the world’s proven reserves combined, an auditor from the Government Accountability Office told Congress on Thursday.

The GAO testimony stressed that the federal government was in “a unique position to influence the development of oil shale” because the Green River deposits were mostly beneath federal land.

It also noted that developing the oil would pose “socioeconomic challenges,” which included bringing “a sizable influx of workers who along with their families put additional stress on local infrastructure” and “making planning for growth difficult for local governments.”

It also noted that developing the oil would pose “socioeconomic challenges,” which included bringing “a sizable influx of workers who along with their families put additional stress on local infrastructure” and “making planning for growth difficult for local governments.”

Sure -- a boomtown. What a terrible prospect, all those jobs and economic growth. Better put a stop to that quick. Has the EPA weighed in yet?

The article says he became a US citizen in '98. I would attach more significance to this if he had been born and raised in the states. His choice to adopt US citizenship was most likely based on convenience. His renunciation of his citizenship is a business decision. Something Americans used to understand.

Eduardo became a US citizen in '98, now renounces in 2012, I doubt his heart ever beat true for the red white and blue. The fact that this is all about money also gives the guy a kind of megalomaniac George Soros vibe, IMO.

Like many other rich and ambitious westerners he moved to Singapore. It's a great place to live and work.

But thanks to increasingly onerous US laws Americans overseas are being strangled by taxes and reporting requirements. Foreign banks are starting to refuse accounts for Americans because of the paperwork.

I know a lot of Americans thinking of taking Singaporean citizenship. If Obama gets another term it will really snowball.

I think he's right to switch citizenship; it's a business decision. It's not even about him or about loyalty to a nation. It's basic economics.

His choice was to either use his money for Investment and Production functions or to hand it over to the government which can only use it for Consumption functions. The government uses taxes to pay its massive bureaucracies and to 'redistribute' to people who do not pay taxes, such as the various entitlements of social services, food stamps etc. A government is not involved in businesses.

To confine the use of profit to merely consumer functions (spend on consumable items) means that that money won't be used to Invest in a new factory or to hire more workers or to develop a new product. That is economically disastrous, not for the individual businessman but for the entire economy. No production, no jobs.

An economy must allow wealth to be put into the first two phases of an economy: Investment and Production. These create wealth; only these two create wealth.If a government prevents these two phases and removes all profit for only the Consumption needs of its citizens, then, it loses the capacity to create wealth. And must rely on China, heh, for its wealth.

E P Taylor.

Nice point bemused. But to points:

1. Drilling I believe is alreaady banned on federal land in the US.
2. You cannot "plan for growth"; you let it happen and trim it when it gets wild. Don't you garden?

Paul Martin Jr.

Being an American may have been a convenience for him in the first place. He only obtained US citizenship in the late 90's.

Nonetheless, the wealthy will always have options, and there arent that many of them, as we are constantly reminded, 1% (although its more like .1%). He is free to make his own decisions, but whatever the downside for him, the 100's of millions in taxes saved would buy him an awful lot of therapy to overcome it.

"I am capitalist to the core..."

No, you're not.

"Yeah, just like those of pet rock fame 'earned it'.
"

What did you earn from the "pet rock" you invented?

stephen - why would refusing to offer millions in taxes for only one economic function, Consumption, move one into requiring therapy?

If, let's say, the Settler, grows a bumper crop of wheat this year, and Consumes all of it, now, in the Present, and even, announces a free handout to all, bringing hundreds of people to his door, what happens next year?

There's no seed for Investment and Production, ie, growing next year's crop. No food.

Wealth or surplus or profit, whatever the name, isn't stashed into old socks; it's Invested into the Future. It goes into setting up the new factory, buying the new equipment, hiring all those hundreds of people in jobs.

Personally, I think the 'I am such a compassionate person' self-nurturing action of handing over all profit for Consumption rather than Investment and Production requires a hard look at one's grasp of reality.

Yeah, he's a modern citizen of the World...

In terms of capital being a very nervous global commodity, another similar angle to look at is the $2 trillion of profits generated offshore over decades by S&P 500 companies. That money is sitting offshore and looking for a place to invest. They could bring that money home to the USA but it would be taxed heavily. Why wouldn’t a sane Washington DC offer a tax holiday for that money to come home and thus encourage investment in the USA?

That investment would lead to production that would lead to new jobs that would lead to income/taxes and consumption of goods …all of which would stimulate the economy 1000’s of times more than Obama’s stimulus that was wasted on items like topping up State pensions for teachers who preach anti-capitalism to our kids.

Who's the greedy one? The person who wants to keep as much of his money for which he has worked, or the person who demands he give up his money to support someone who thinks he deserves it.

Money talks and B.S. walks. Sure the rich could just sit around and listen to self hating losers camp out in the park demanding money and calling them names.

Or they can go somewhere that lets them keep more of their money and does not call them names.

It's a funny world the dumber by design students of the public school system feel those that want to support there lifestyle by taking other peoples money are OK. But someone who wants to become wealthy by creating something that people want and willing part with their money to get are evil.

What is important is that The Wealthy Man does NOT keep his wealth. He doesn't store it in old socks. It's useless in thos socks.

The profit is INVESTED! It's put into building new factories, more production facilities, hiring more people, shipping more goods, carrying out research!

Governments don't engage in Investment! They don't engage in Production! All governments do is Consume money. They take it from the people and then, after paying their fat cat bureaucrats their double-the-private-sector wages, benefits and pensions, they distribute it to other Consumers.

But wealth is created only by Investing it in businesses, industries, workers and Producing something of value! It's a cycle. When governments prevent Investment and Production, by removing all the money that is put into Investment and Production....the economy freezes.

But, gosh, those bureaucrats and entitled-to-their-entitlement Consumers still require their Consumer Money. So, heh, the government must borrow it from nations that do allow Investment and Production. Such as China.

peterj said: "any logical reason exept pure unadultrated greed to leave the country that made that kind of profit possible."

How about revenge peterj?

I've already been through this mill myself. I left Ontario in 1992 to get the education in the USA that layer after layer of apparatchiks denied me here in Canada. Graduated, started working. Nightmare.

Its not greed making this guy leave. I can tell you all from personal experience, the United States Government does not create good feelings in -legal- immigrants to America. They are arrogant, STUPID, capricious and contradictory. Successfully negotiating their Green Card process is much more a matter of luck than anything else. Citizenship process is the same, if you weren't born an American you are NOT going to love the place by the time they oh-so-magnanimously grant you citizenship. You're going to be itching for some payback.

So Savarin managed to bow and scrape his way through that citizenship nightmare as a kid, and now that HE has the power he's told them to stick it up their @ss.

Hell yeah. I'd do it in a heartbeat.

In fact I did do it. I moved home to Canada, purely because I couldn't stand to f- around with their Immigration Department crap any more. Told them to take their Green Card and shove it. In person. Worth it just to see the look on her face.

I guarantee you peterj that the US government did NOT make it possible for this Savarin guy to create Facebook and make a billion bucks. He did it in spite of every rock they threw in his path, and he's earned every d@mn nickle.

Maybe it's because it was late Friday night, but there's a whole lotta stupid flying around this thread. From the top:

Phantom: Singapore is NOT part of "Communist China" - where did you get that idea, Rush?

peterj: What you don't know about taxation would clearly fill volumes. In the US, at least for now, you are taxed on income, not wealth. If Saverin doesn't sell any of his stock, his only income is whatever FB pays him, and that's what he would pay tax on.

Oz: Warren Buffet pays taxes. Lots of them. But because most of his income is from capital gains - i.e. money made on money that has already been taxed - and/or dividends - again, money that comes from a corporation after it has been taxed - Buffet pays taxes at a lower rate than someone who is paying the top marginal rate on ordinary income (e.g. his $200,000/yr secretary). Berkshire also pays taxes - 17% of income, IIRC. He doesn't have a "sweetheart" deal with Bambam.

Ultimately, this is a philosophical issue. At one end are people who think once you've paid tax on the money, you shouldn't have to pay tax on it again just because you used it wisely. At the other end are the people who think the state owns all your wealth, and you should not only be taxed on what you earn, but also what you have. Under Bambam, which group do you think is in ascendancy in the US?

Severin, like many others, is reading the writing on the wall, and acting accordingly. When a country is $16 trillion in debt, and that load gets heavier and heavier, faster and faster, every single year, something's going to break. As we've seen throughout history, and as I've mentioned here more than once, what usually happens is a revolution in the streets, accompanied by forcible redistribution of the formerly wealthy's stuff. Of course, it doesn't work - it didn't work in France in the 1790's, it didn't work for Russia in 1917, it didn't work for Greece in the 1960's, etc., etc. Some portion of the rich always escape, while others stay, convinced "It can't happen here". So far, in the US of A, I'm pretty sure that only the 2nd Amendment has kept the thieves at bay. But with DHS buying hundreds of millions of rounds, even that may no longer be enough.

I do find myself agreeing with almost all the comments left after 8 am this morning, starting with Chip.

all these bleeding heart lefties in here that think renouncing his citizenship is all about greed. It ain't!! I am against the gun registery, not because I own, or want to own a gun, but because it places a restriction on my freedom, EVEN THOUGH I DON'Y OWN A GUN

Phantom - the disgraceful treatment of people by the INS and Customs service is widespread.

I put it down to they leave millions of illegals unmolested, so to generate tough-looking statistics that suggest they are doing their jobs, they harass every legit individual they can.

What a disgrace.

Saverin is following the #1 rule of investing.

Preserve your capital.

He can see the devaluation of everything American globally. If the money he gains through his investment, hard work, ingenuity and inspiration are not preserved, the work will be for naught.

Obama is moving the States to socialism and the people of the land are too stupid or afraid or have been brainwashed into believing that socialism is the new "New Deal".

Severin will be seen as one of the smart ones who was able to get out in time.

I've read a few comments and think I should add in some facts. First, Facebook does make a lot of money off of advertising, just like Google. Second, this guy was not born or raised in the US, so this isn't as traitorous as it may seem. Third, for the redistribution of wealth folks, if you had that money, would you prefer to start one of the world's largest charities and give to your causes or dump it into the US Gov black hole? Either way there's some hypocrisy here... you would do the something.

Guess they could just build walls, physical, financial, legal, to keep people from leaving..... wonder if that has been tried before??????

Et,

Earning millions doesnt require you to go into therapy. It is a bad rhetorical device to highlight the absurd thought that someone should feel guilty about it

Et,

Earning millions doesnt require you to go into therapy. It is a bad rhetorical device to highlight the absurd thought that someone should feel guilty about it

ET, KevinB and NME666 say it all!

Keeping your own earned wealth cannot be greed.
Wanting to take someone else's wealth because it exceeds some arbitrary limit IS.

I find nothing more offensive than the arrogance of some people concluding that some other people "don't need it", which is not entirely unlike the notion that a sexy chick was asking for it!

In fact, I'm still pi88sed over the OAS clawback, which you will recall is based on the notion that people over a certain threshold "don't need it". I'll decide that, thank you very much. That was a broken social contract, period.

The most patriotic thing you can do is to pay the absolute minimum in income taxes and invest to benefit the masses without of course being motivated by this outcome. As Mises points out, entrepreneurs don't really OWN the capital; they hold it as custodians and only so long as they SERVE the sovereign consumer.

I've been reflecting lately that just as Buffett never invested in high-tech 'cos he didn't understand it, the tech entrepreneurs got fabulously wealthy and brought untold benefits to the masses 'cos this is one area in which government has not really intervened, probably 'cos, like Buffett, they didn't understand it.

He IS leaving out of greed. And there's nothing wrong with that. Greed is just a desire to improve one's lot.

Get used to the wealth fleeing; they are already fleeing France in droves after the election last week.

Singapore is a Socialist police state that allows people with money to have the good life and those that do not a slavish service existence; I lived there for 10 years it caters to the wealthy.

That said, the Progressive Liberal commies of our society have spent the last decades tearing down patriotism along with language, borders and culture. So what allegiance does any wealthy person owe the country now? Why pay high tax’s to feed the useless and lazy when you can move to any “developing” country and live like a king with just a little money. If you have billions you can co-rule most of these places as a Fascist shareholder.