Haiti

I'm waiting to see factual not speculative reports. I'm not interested in 'there may be hundreds of thousands dead' but in actual accounts. Why?

Because Haiti is not simply the poorest country in that area - right smack next to the Dominican Republic - which is doing very well; it is one of the most if not THE most corrupt nation in that area. And it's been that way for a very long time with no hint of any change.

I suspect that monies sent to Haiti might - and I admit that I am the one speculating - but might go into the pockets of those corrupt - and Haiti will rebuild its substandard 'housing', set up its substandard services, and repeat itself as the most corrupt and impoverished nation in that area...but with the corrupt set massively enriched by this international aid.

Billions will be spent to prop up that wasteland, Haiti. Nothing will improve. The country is and always has been a total sink hole of corruption, tyranny and ignorance. It cannot be changed nor saved. Haiti makes New Orleans look like Switzerland. It is like a little bit of Africa right here in the Caribbean. What a mess. I am trying to feel sorry for the Haitians, but I can't. There is no point.

In situations like the Haiti disaster, I contribute to Global Medic. The members are volunteers with emergency services backgrounds who do critical work fighting to bring potable water and emergency hospital facilities to ravaged areas as quickly as possible to try to prevent epidemics and further massive loss of life.

http://www.globalmedic.ca/missions/Haiti/earthquake_jan_2010/main.html

Watch as America shoulders nintey percent of the releif and rebuild effort and a year from now the Haitians will be yelling death to America. Just like they did in Indonesia about a year after their sunami.

Some of the comments made so far are sickening.

Steve, many of us will help however we can, but the point remains Haiti is a corrupt hellhole.

Thanks for the link Sgt.

I've traveled extensively in Haiti, usually renting a Suzuki dirt bike in the D.R. then making my way to the Haitian border. No passport required, just a small bribe of about 10 US$ and your in.

Abe is right, when there I always get the feeling I'm in Equatorial Guinea or Madagascar. A group of Haitians once tried to sell me an armadillo for $5. For another $2 they'd tie it to the seat of the motorcycle. I didn't buy it because it seemed to have an attitude problem. In hindsight I could have made a decent profit reselling it to the Hells Angels in Puerto Plata.

Corruption or not, that's not what is important now.

I trust that some of the deplorable commmenters have been watching a little too much Pat Robertson:

http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/201001130024

Hey Steve,

A good place for you to puke is on the grave of Papa Doc Duval.

Stevie,

Pat Robertson is an idiot and no one pays attention to him but idiots like you who try to lump him in as a normal everyday conservative.

Steve - how much of your hard-earned cash are you willing to bet that the Presidential Palace will be rebuilt before much is done to replace housing for the common folk?

Those are legitimate concerns when it comes to the corrupt government operating in Haiti. It is what it is.

Some of the comments made so far are sickening.
Posted by: Steve at January 13, 2010 3:18 PM

Can't handle the truth Steve?

How many pairs of rose colored glasses do you own?

steve - is it sickening to support corruption?

Are you that naive and quite frankly, stupid, that you would enable the corrupt govt and powerbrokers of Haiti to USE a natural disaster to further enrich themselves?

Do you want to help Haitians who need the help, which their govt has NEVER provided? Did Haitians, before this earthquake, have hospitals, medical service, adequate communication services, clean water, decent housing, hydro, food. No, they didn't. Why not?

Because their govt is corrupt and has been for generations. The CIA report: 'more than 2/3 of the labour force don't have formal jobs; over 80% live below the poverty line; 4 airports with paved runways...and so on.

Do you want this to continue? Do you want to enable this to continue? Yes? Then send your money and exhort govts to send their money to the Haitian govt and Haitian services.

Otherwise, do as sgt lejaune suggests and send ONLY to agencies that employ their own, non-Haitian staff who are NOT in the control of any Haitian authorities.

Haiti is the world center of the Voodoo religion.

Haitians, apart from homosexual males and intravenous drug abusers, have historically been a major nexus for the spread of HIV.

Talking about greed and corruption, would Haiti be more like the Dominican Republic, second largest economy in the Caribbean, if it weren't for the influence of French and Voodoo in Haitian culture?

armadillos, which are mammals, are believed to be the only significant natural reservoir of leprosy apart from humans

corruption or not, that's a sickening and sad revelation of your character lady.

I'm praying for those poor buggers down there. And donating to the Red Cross.

pics here: http://www.boston.com/news/world/latinamerica/articles/2010/01/13/powerful_quake_ravages_haiti/

they're people for chrissakes. Really poor people horribly unprepared for an event that will make a generation of people.

and all you hyper-politicized gerbils in here can talk about is what a shithole it is.

Why yes, it is.

Why do you clowns insist on putting a foot down on someone's throat - when they're on the ground?

True revelation of the calibre and character of some in here.

I agree the comments here are sickening, but they speak the truth.
We cannot bury our heads in the sand and ignore
the reality that is Haiti.

Leave the French out of Haitian culture, The Haitians threw off the French yoke a long time ago and have had _PLENTY_ to time to at least become a modestly badly run Carribean nation with a serious crime problem.

Instead they have conciously, at every opportunity since independence, shot themselves in the foot. Kleptocracy in action with a "democratic" veneer.

Every seen the country from air? You can _see_ the border with the D.R. the environment is so degraded on the Haitian side due to bad land management and overpopulation.

A terrible tragedy. I feel for the people of Haiti. I hope enough aid gets there fast, and that it gets to the ones who need it.

Thanks for the link Sgt. Legeune.

As for "normal everyday conservative"'s, Abe, please don't do the rest of us an extreme disservice by lumping your comments in with theirs. Snap out of it, buddy. These people deserve compassion and need help, right now. The government of Haiti is a big problem, but you've extended your feelings about them to include their primary victims - the Haitian people. Thankfully your lack of caring is not representative of the everyday conservatives I know, or our current government.

And OZ - disgusting and ignorant. Predictably so.

Oz: Voodoo is just syncretized west African religion and Catholicism.

It's not especially "dangerous" to progress in some magical way.

On another note, however, the predictable conspiracy lunacy has already started, just like with Indonesia.

Every earthquake is the result of secret US "weather weapon" testing, don'tcha know?

My,my.Aren't the lefties upset that it is being pointed out how corrupt,soul destroying,generally people hating their type of gubermint is?And they use a natural disaster as an excuse.Losers
Haiti was a hell hole long before Mother Nature stepped in,and it was a hell hole caused 100% by the dictators running it.Sgt Lejeune has the right idea.Support the groups that directly help the people.Never,ever give your bucks to some feel good,leftie org like United Way,CCF etc.(unless you like helping people steal from those it was meant for)
Now just waiting for the it was Bush's fault...in 3..2

ahh, gosh, hardboiled, and now we find out your True Nature. Bigoted and rejecting reality.

You are utterly indifferent to Haitian corruption but, hmmm, you are obsessed, absolutely obsessed, with what you deem is the corruption of the Conservative government and the Evil Agenda of, in particular, Harper.

And notice, that it's your perception that defines this 'Conservative corruption' and this 'Evil Harper. Not reality. Just your perception all by yourself.

Gosh, that Haitian govt and that corrupt economy - well, 'they are people for chrissakes'. Hmm, so too is our government. So too is Harper.

But what you are ignoring is that this corrupt govt will make millions out of this disaster and how much will go to the people who need it? Hmm? Why do you ignore this? You spend lots of time and space here fuming about the Conservatives and Harper and money - and yet, you have nothing to say about a REAL, ACTUAL corrupt govt in Haiti. Except that 'it's sickening' to talk that way. Is it?

No, the comments here are NOT sickening. What is sickening is the corruption of Haiti - that has set up a situation where there are no regular hospitals run by them but everything is donated and run by other countries and external charitable foundations. Building codes? Non-existent. Education? About half are illiterate; quite something in our day and age; even worse than Afghanistan.

Again - do you want this to continue? Do you support the international world sending its money to the Haitian govt, ...which will continue the corruption and enrich itself?

As I said, if you want to send money, send it only to external organizations that have no contact with the Haitian authorities. And learn a bit about corruption and why Haiti, in contrast to the Dominican Republic RIGHT NEXT TO IT, is a mess.

You know sigivald the problem with your 'touching little analogy' about voodoo is that for some strange reason the way people believe is the way they act. Where Christianity dominates nations like Canada and the USA are produced. Where Islam dominates and you get Iran or Somalia. Where Voodoo prevails Haiti happens.

You stay classy, Kate McMillan.

Stuff your self-righteousness, Steve.

The comments about corruption and the possibility of international relief going straight into the warehouses and pockets of sleazy politicians couldn't be more on-target.

How do I know?

I lived in the Caribbean for a few years and was in the middle of an earthquake larger than the Haitian one. What shocked me most, after surviving the earthquake itself, was what happened afterwards.

I always say that if you're lucky/blessed/fortunate enough to survive a major disaster in a third-world country, your troubles are only beginning.

There was money pouring into the country from around the world -- documented every day in the major daily out of the capital city -- and hardly any of it made it down to the people at the epicentre of the quake, in the middle of a jungle, or to the other people most adversely affected by the quake.

I was gobsmacked to see the corruption, to see who benefited from the international largesse: the politicians in the capital (there was more than a rumour going around that the wife of the president of the country had a warehouse she was stocking for her and her family's personal use) and the local politicians who were handling the "relief effort" (sic) were giving everything to their family members and friends, NOT to the people who were in most need. I saw it with my own eyes.

Those who actually rolled up their sleeves and did effective relief work that made a difference, and as volunteers, were the churches, unions, and co-ops in the area. Their efforts were heroic, with no thanks to the government agencies who barely lifted a finger to help in the human misery caused by the quake.

And, yes, the American military more than pulled their weight and were on the scene within hours. While they were flying people out in Hercules (the roads into the area were impassable and the hospital was operating at only 1/3 capability) and delivering relief materials -- food, medicine, water -- the government operatives, both local and up in the capital, were feathering their own nests, stuffing their own bank accounts, and rubbing their hands together because they could use some of the revenue to pay back the IMF (International Monetary Fund) loan that had just been called in.

Most relief money and resources sent via the Haitian government will be siphoned off for their own use. That's pretty much a given -- and no surprise if you look at the habitual corruption in Haiti.

The best way to send help to the Haitians, who are going through Hell now, is through a church organization or a charity you can trust, like the one that Sgt Lejaune mentions. Very little of the money you donate in this way goes to administration -- and it definitely doesn't go into the pockets of those administering the relief resources.

And pray for them.

Leave the French out of Haitian culture, The Haitians threw off the French yoke a long time ago
~Fred2

Ever notice the difference in quality of life between the average former French colonies and the average former English colonies?
Probably not.

By the way do Haitians still speak French?
I guess speaking and writing in French has no impact on a people's culture so forget I asked.
No Haitians probably read French books or watch French TV shows or listen to French radio ever since they threw off the French yoke in Haiti.

Jimbo, facts are facts.
I didn't say they deserved an earthquake or that no one should give them any aid.
So I guess you don't like me?
Oh well.

Oz: Voodoo is just syncretized west African religion and Catholicism.
It's not especially "dangerous" to progress in some magical way.
~Sigivald

Yeah, I knew it was a syncretism between RC and West African religion.
Did I say Voodoo was dangerous or a bad thing?
No, I checked and I didn't.

Isn't someone going to try and slam me about armadillos?

ET.
The Dominican Republic ain't no poster boy for
democracy either. Just check out their sugar plantations and the Haitian slaves they employ.
In Haiti the Santarian "religion" and the ton-ton m'acoutes have essentially controlled Haiti since the departure of the French. As Dr. Phil would say, "you can't change what you don't acknowledge".
Very sad situation indeed.

One other thing: I was listening to the news a few minutes ago where I heard that Foreign Affairs Minister, Lawrence Cannon, was keeping in touch with contacts in Haiti re the 6000 Canadians who live in Haiti.

http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2010/01/13/12445781-qmi.html

"There are about 6,000 Canadians living in Haiti, but only 707 are registered."

How is this possible? 6000 Canadians living in Haiti? 'Another issue, but what the ...?

Pursuant to the post yesterday about the anti-Harper sentiment in the comments on the CBC website related to the Haiti disaster (WTF?), I wonder if PMSH will next come under fire from the CBC for not deploying relief *before* the earthquake struck??

And, then, another thing I meant to mention in my first post: The UN was useless. They sent armbanded personnel down to the area most affected by the quake "to monitor the situation."

I was pretty naive in those days and thought, for sure, that the UN would blow the whistle on the corruption in plain sight for all to see.

Silly me. They didn't do a darned thing about the corruption. Business as usual, boys. Carry on. Of course, UN headquarters was a gated estate in the middle of one of the affluent neighbourhoods in the capital.

My rose-coloured glasses turned red that year.

My condolences to those who lost family/friends.

In 2006, Canada committed to providing $555 million in aid to Haiti over five years, making Haiti the second biggest recipient of Canadian development aid next to Afghanistan. Canada is the second largest donor country in Haiti, which is the poorest country in the Western Hemisphere.
FROM:

http://canadahaitiaction.ca/?p=384

atric - if the Dominican sugar farms employ Haitians, then, by definition, they aren't slaves but employees.

There is no comparison between the two countries. Literacy in the DR is 87% while in Haiti it's 50%. Strong GDP growth in the DR. Unmployment at 14% vs over 60%% in Haiti. Over 80% below poverty in Haiti and 42% in DR. And Haitians, escaping the corruption and poverty of Haiti are the largest minority group in the DR but most are illegals and unskilled.

Could you explain why the DR should support them as equal to their own citizens...which action would result, as in the US, in massive migration OUT of Haiti into the DR, which would be unable to accomodate an unskilled, uneducated population unable to work in any but the most lowly jobs?

What should be done? It's in the hands of Haiti and its govt - and it has refused to act as a responsible govt and educate its people, provide an economic infrastucture, provide a housing and medical infrastructure ...leaving it all up to international organizations to 'carry the people' while the elite get wealthy. That's Haiti.

hardboiled, if you want your charitable givings to go to Haitians who genuinely need it DON'T give it to the Red Cross.

The Red Cross in other countries is administered by locals who tend to favour their families and friends.

How do I know this?

In my situation, I got together a lot of clothing my family didn't need for the children in the tent city that had resulted after hundreds of people had been displaced. When I asked my neighbour how to get in touch with the Red Cross, she looked at me as though I was crazy.

She said, "Don't give it to the Red Cross. They'll give it all to their friends and families." "So," I asked, "how do I get it to them?"

She said I should go down to the tent city myself, walk in, kids would run up to me, their moms would follow -- give it to the moms. So, that's what I did.

sickoids slavering at the mouth to vent their hatred on innocent victims

What, marquis, you think that the members of the corrupt Haitian government are victims? Those are the people who are getting it in the jugular from the commenters here.

Do you have a processing problem, or difficulty reading English, or are you just willfully an idiot?

The comments here are pathetic, and don't belong in a sewer.

You over-politicized anuses are an embarrassment to this blog, conservatism, and the human race.

A massive tragedy - with tens of thousands of lives lost - and a yack it up about corrupt Carribean governments is the topic du jour.

You people....are slime.

I hope Kate pulls the chain on this one, and ends this embarrassment. Shit.

batb, I suspect that it is all three. Liberals love it when other leaders rip off their people to.

"I'm praying for those poor buggers down there. And donating to the Red Cross."
~hardboiled at January 13, 2010 3:56 PM

Would you be donating to the Canadian Red Cross that gave tainted blood to 60,000+ Canadians or the International Red Cross that helped all those Nazi SS War Criminals escape justice?

"I hope Kate pulls the chain on this one, and ends this embarrassment. Shit."

Aside from Kate's brilliance and humor, part of the success of this blog is that it doesn't sensor. It's free speech zone. Something that people like you have trouble recognizing ... dude!

ET, I wasn't trashing the DR, merely pointing out
that they are not especially a shining star in the Caribbean. Yes, they do "employ" Haitians however I suggest you take a look at how they are treated by the plantation owners and how the government overlooks it. Try this for starters.
http://www.iabolish.org/slavery_today/country_reports/do.html
More importantly, a senior Haitian official is quoted as saying the country has totally collapsed.While the loss of life is to be grieved,
perhaps this is what the country needs in order to rebuild and adopt a different form of governance.
I can only hope that what foreign aid is sent to them is spent wisely. I'm not holding my breath, though.

Stuff it, hardboiled. You go and spend a few years in the Caribbean, living with the people, helping them despite all of the corruption, having your house robbed, your kids with parasites, and THEN you can accuse us of being anuses.

You know NADA.

Hardboiled, do you have a reading comprehension problem? No one is saying don't aid the Haitians just do it through proven aid organizations that will get the aid to those who require it not skim it for themselves. There is no difference between Zimbabwe or Haiti in the way their greedy, corrupt government has driven their countries into the ground.

It seems if people don't support your POV their scum and cruel. Go back to your specialty of ripping up the CPC.

I remember flying into the DR some 35 years ago and seeing brown runoff of soil from Haiti spreading miles out to sea as the mountains were denuded of all forestation while the DR was lush green with sparkling beaches. Different people, same island.

hardbubbled

you've done an excellent job over time proving yourself an idiot, give it a rest, we're convinced already!!!

now answer me this, HAVE YOU EVER BEEN TO A THIRD WORLD NATION AS OTHER THAN A TOURIST?????

What a bunch of pathetic hateful comments we have here. No wonder any reasonable conservative avoids this place like the plague.

"The comments here are pathetic, and don't belong in a sewer.

You over-politicized anuses are an embarrassment to this blog, conservatism, and the human race.

A massive tragedy - with tens of thousands of lives lost - and a yack it up about corrupt Carribean governments is the topic du jour.

You people....are slime.

I hope Kate pulls the chain on this one, and ends this embarrassment. Shit.

Posted by: hardboiled at January 13, 2010 6:20 PM"

+1. Couldn't agree more. This is not the time and the place for those kinds of comments. Embarrassing doesn't begin to cover it.

Soooooooo......when is our beloved,Hatian GG going down to help her fellow people????? Or does she need jimbo and softboiled?

jimbo and hardboiled: reasonable conservatives are the basic population of this site. So if you are going to descend to the childishness of insults at least try to get your insults accurate.

hardboiled is using his comments to get back at people who have criticized his endless irrational rants against the Conservative govt and Harper. He's ignored what people are really talking about here.

And you and he are ignoring that to naively give millions to Haiti - which the Canadian govt for example has been doing for many years - does nothing but enrich and enable the corruption and poverty to continue. Is that your agenda?

Are you giving because it makes YOU feel good or because you are trying to help Haitians. If the latter, then as so many of us have pointed out, you MUST be aware of the corruption. Giving millions now to this govt will not help the people; it will continue the corruption.

The only way to help the people in need is to give only to those agencies that are NOT involved with the Haitian govt and whose members are NOT part of the bureaucracy in Haiti but are external to the country.

Did you know that 2/3rd of the homes in Haiti, even before this earthquake, were essentially shacks that could not withstand anything - hurricane or tremor? Do you know why the devasatation is so large? It's because the monies that have POURED into Haiti for years and years have gone to the govt and the elite.

There is no infrastructure in Haiti; no internal medical infrastructure, no decent educational system, no decent economic system, most of the population are unemployed or underemployed; most live below the poverty line. And the ONLY reason for this situation - is the governance of Haiti.

Do you want this to continue? You do? Well then...urge govts to hand over millions to the Haitian govt.
You don't? Then SPEAK OUT about the corruption and give only to external agencies whose personnel are external to the internal politics and scams of Haiti.

Oh, and enjoy your sanctimonious false morality.

My best friend is Haitian so I hope all his family is okay. Like EVERYONE here, my heart goes out to the victims of the disaster.

None of these feelings change the reality of peoples concerns for the corruption issue. So called "progressive" people should consider that philanthropic dollars that are not lost to corruption are more effective at helping people. A logical person would rather see those dollars help someone somewhere else than have it stolen simply to be part of the vogue cause.

How do you know HB is a liberal?

Besides the obvious, HB still maintains that he's a conservative. It's difficult to definitely demonstrate a wolf in sheep's clothing but I think I've got it.

Politics aside HB, your uncontrollable liberal urge to point fingers and name-call you betrays your guise. It’s analogous to Peyton Manning wearing a Ravens uniform standing in the Ravens huddle, except he’s calling plays from the Colts playbook. Sure he looks like a Raven, but as soon as he opens his mouth everyone in the huddle knows it’s espionage. Fortunately this isn’t football, it’s the internet; and the consequences are not as harsh or painful as it would be getting busted in the wrong huddle.

According to Jimbo the time to discuss the final destination of relief funds is after they've been stolen.