The Sound Of Settled Science

actually 50 years would be an eternity in individual dinosaur time. volcanics has long been suspected of being the killer.

there have been at least 4 major shifts in climate since dinosaurs resulting in big mammal changes but somehow the dinosaurs have stolen the spotlight. including an extinction event at the Oligocene. and of course an extintion event at the ice ages.

man , the nake d ape of success is a result of global warming (not a cause), apres ice age , likely being only a few hundred individuals during the ice age

Yes.

Reading about the Deccan and Siberian traps, and their allied volcanic type events is terrifying even at Megayears remove.

Yeah, um, er Does this mean that Kate is going to have to change her theme for the dying newspapers?

I don't know from dinosaurs. I only have a clue where we're at when we get to Paleoanthropology. I'm sure this has something to do with the climate, but could someone please explain? Please?

The moral here is that consensus is meaningless and science is NEVER settled.

“We found that not a single species went extinct as a result of the Chicxulub impact"...These are astonishing results.”

From one extreme to another.
How could they find that not even a single species went extinct? Do they know this for sure? Maybe one species actually did go extinct.

These people are always pretending to be absolute authorities when they are only guessing. How tiresome.

It's all about the 'Shock Factor' - shakes loose the funding.

If science survives the 21st century it'll be a miracle.

Okay, it was a Volcano as opposed to meteor. Don't make no nevermind. Anyone?

I am a geologist myself and I would want to read the entire article before agreeing. There IS a lot of evidence that the Chicxulub Event and the demise of the dinosaurs were coincident - though to a geologist, 300Kyr is pretty coincident especially 65Myr ago. There were a heck of a lot of dinosaurs elsewhere on Earth and NOT in the Americas. The Deccan Traps was also a really major event that could have done the job but they were persistent for between 1Myr - rapid emplacement model - or 8Myr - flood basalt model.

If the Deccan Traps were around for even 1Myr, the "Thin Layer of Iridium enriched clay" at the KT boundary would be a bit thicker and much much more eroded. The arguments roll on.

One thing though, the Chixulub equivalent of the snail darter or Spotted Owl would really truly be extinct.

I'm sure that they should have said that they have no EVIDENCE that a single species went extinct...not that none did. Almost certainly, a localized species (as noted by KimW) would have been very effectively extinguished.

Having said that, it is still possible that the asteroid impact was a catalyst for the eventual demise of the dinosaurs. Is it possible that there is a link between the asteroid strike and an increase in the severity of the volcanic eruptions at the Deccan and Siberian traps?

It will remain only an educated guess, regardless of how much of taxpayer's money we throw at it.

This puts the whole time line thing in prospective for some of us.
http://news.yahoo.com/comics/bc;_ylt=AgH4r4.FSsCHG4EdjiUwvL_6cLQF
one mans hundred years is another mans thousand years is another mans ..............

oz, i agree. it would seem that speculation now passes for or as science.

one minute is a long time to hang by the neck..

This event might not have caused the extinction of all dino's, but I'd be willing to bet that it made all at ground zero instantly extinct. And without leaving a trace

The moral of the story is that scientists are just people who have a job like everyone else. They aren't all Einsteins. They mostly aren't smarter than any other group of professionals.

The other moral is that human beings have a broad tendency to grossly over-estimate their own intelligence and their level of understanding. In other words, they tend to think they know far more than they do.

A nine hundred giga tonne meteor hits the earth and not one species is lost. Drive by a rainforest with an SUV, and dozens of species dissapear. Quite amazing, isn't it.

LoL, Woodporter. Too true.

Interesting results. What I like about science is its dynamism. It's never static or "settled" and it forces me to constantly re-evaluate my place in the world. It's also humbling because it necessitates a healthy degree of self-doubt. One can approach the truths of nature asymptotically but never actually fully know them.
It will be interesting to see how this theory plays out amongst paleontologists. But as Keynes said, "When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?"

Woodporter'

SWEET.... I just sprayed coffee all over my key board. (-:

DrD

Speak for yourself. I'd prefer science be settled, it would be cheaper then(in theory).

woodporter

good point. SUV's are evil.

KimW

I'm glad we have an expert on the panel. Have you considered that the dinosaurs extinction could have been caused by mass spontaneous combustions due to dinosaurs holding in their farts? Could the Ice age have been an unintended consequence of dinosaurs combating global warming by holding their farts?

BTW have you spoken to Randy Marsh lately?

Actually, this is an example of how science works. The impact theory is only a few decades old. It's fairly solid though, and this challenge is merely one example, so it means everyone will be searching for evidence to further prove their theories. It's nothing to sneer at.

As for climate science... all anyone is saying, is that we have significant enough evidence to begin shifting our economies, and conserving energy. That's it.

It's you dummies who resist even that. Oddly enough... despite being "conserv"-atives, you advocate reckless use of our resources.

You want to know what's settled? That you guys have completely lost touch with anything even remotely resembling reality.

The uber-left Guardian/MSM has this.

Guardian newsman says, scientists are fevered? Fevered? (Pigs at the trough? We'll let that pass).

But, the question is: "Where will it all end?"

Could manbearpig have the Answer? Yes. Read on.

Yes, according to ? it's peanuts. Don't worry.
...-

"The sun's cooling down - so what does that mean for us?

The sun's activity is winding down, triggering fevered debate among scientists about how low it will go, and what it means for Earth's climate. Nasa recorded no sunspots on 266 days in 2008 - a level of inactivity not seen since 1913 - and 2009 looks set to be even quieter. Solar wind pressure is at a 50-year low and our local star is ever so slightly dimmer than it was 10 years ago.

Sunspots are the most visible sign of an active sun - islands of magnetism on the sun's surface where convection is inhibited, making the gas cooler and darker when seen from Earth - and the fact that they're vanishing means we're heading into a period of solar lethargy.

Where will it all end?"
urlm.in/cfey

Come now John... you really expect everyone to fall for Al Gores nonsense, your free to walk lock step all you like but I still won't insult your intelligence.

You make "shifting economies" sound about the same as "redistributing wealth", and as far as conserving energy goes and I've said this before wheres my rebate check for buying florescent light bulbs a decade ago when they where fifthteen bucks a piece while being way ahead of the learning curve because I wanted to try and save money. I didn't have to be scolded or lied too by little piss ant do gooders, and their masters that manage the newest collective where individual thought is regarded as evil.

Take off the blinders John and live like a free man.

Feynman: Inconceivable nature of nature

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AU8PId_6xec&feature=related

Are you the one who is "if we keep turning the temperature of the Earth up,"?

It's getting worser and worser than the "experts" previous "worst-case scenarios": "worse than the worst-case scenarios presented by experts a few years ago."

Silly. Turn it down.
Goreacle "pleads" for Gaia's sake.

Goreacle explains: "if we keep turning the temperature of the Earth up, then the heat will go to lower depths of the Arctic Ocean and it will be impossible for the ice to come back.""

That's enough of the inverted manbearpig forever.
...-

"Gore pleads for rapid action to halt ice melt

Nobel prize climate champion and former US vice president Al Gore called Tuesday for rapid action to prevent the potentially irreversible melting of the planet's ice, just months before a UN climate summit.

Speaking at the first conference devoted to melting ice, held in the Norwegian town of Tromsoe ahead of the UN meeting in Copenhagen in December, Gore warned that the situation was worse than the worst-case scenarios presented by experts a few years ago.

"This conference is a global wake-up call," Gore said, adding: "The scientific evidence for action in Copenhagen in December is continuing to build up week by week."

He explained why the melting ice posed such a threat to the planet.

"Ice is important through the ecological system of the Earth for many reasons, but one of them has to do with its reflexivity," he said.

Ice reflects 90 percent of the sun's radiation back into the atmosphere. If the ice were to melt, the dark water would not reflect the heat but instead absorb it, thereby accentuating the effect of global warming.

"As it disappears we have to keep in mind that it can come back only if we act fairly quickly," said Gore, who shared the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize with the UN's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.

He explained that "if we keep turning the temperature of the Earth up, then the heat will go to lower depths of the Arctic Ocean and it will be impossible for the ice to come back."
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2239707/posts

Vestas is not the bestest blade* in the grass. Jabberwock* is bestest than Vestas.
...-

"Britain's only wind turbine plant to close

Vestas is to shut down its Isle of Wight factory in the face of collapsing demand from a wind-farming industry hobbled by the recession and red tape"
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/apr/28/vestas-wind-turbine-factory-close
...-

"Jabberwocky
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack! He left it dead, and with its head. He went galumphing back. "And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?"
(H/T Lewis Carroll)

"It's you dummies who resist even that. Oddly enough... despite being "conserv"-atives, you advocate reckless use of our resources."

BS John, any bit of research and you'll find that there is no shortage of fossil fuels. The Americans have more shale oil available than the total amount of oil burned in history. Mankind is good for another 100 years, plenty of time to make the bird-blenders work. If you leftards were ahead of the curve you’d have argued for pig blenders instead. If you want to argue that man is causing global warming then so be it, but please don't try and pass nonsensical and nonrelated arguments to prove your point.

Although dated and in some areas incorrect Officer and Page's book "The Great Dinosaur Controversy" has a good description of how the dubious asteroid theory became accepted as fact.

The whole theory depends on whether it is possible to drive a car into a group of people and kill only those that are left handed, in short asteroid strikes cannot selectively kill a class of animals that survived in a variety of climates. See Bakker's The Dinosaur Heresies.

BTW, the dinos aren't dead, they're birds now.

What's next bob; the Dinosaur Flu?

More Guardian: Windmill Farming by Don Quixote.
...-

"Anger at plans for nuclear power station to replace wind farm

• Threatened site is one of the most efficient
• Proposed atomic plant backed by government

One of the oldest and most efficient wind farms in Britain is to be dismantled and replaced by a nuclear power station under plans drawn up by the German-owned power group RWE.

The site at Kirksanton in Cumbria - home to the Haverigg turbines - has just been approved by the government for potential atomic newbuild in a move that has infuriated the wind power industry.

Colin Palmer, founder of the Windcluster company, which owns part of the Haverigg wind farm, said he was horrified that such a plan could be considered at a time when Britain risks missing its green energy targets and after reassurance from ministers that nuclear and renewables were not incompatible.

"My first reaction was disbelief, quickly followed by a sense of years of commitment to sustainable energy being destroyed," Palmer said. "At a time when the government is calling for wind energy development to be accelerated, it beggars belief that they are supporting plans that will result in the destruction of existing capacity.""
urlm.in/cfvm

I see that Indiana Homez commented to the effect, "I'm glad we have an expert on the panel. Have you considered that the dinosaurs extinction could have been caused by mass spontaneous combustions due to dinosaurs holding in their farts? Could the Ice age have been an unintended consequence of dinosaurs combating global warming by holding their farts?"

I'll treat these two questions seriously. Dinosaur farts - No. Simplistic answer - No spontaneous combustion mechanism proposed. Ice Age cause - No. I will actually - since you do not appear to have access to the data - briefly outline the reason for the second No answer. The most recent Ice Ages occurred in the Pleistocene c. 2 million years ago - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleistocene - and actually consisted of the Gunz, Mindel, Riss and Wurm Glacials - you can change the names but the Glacials are still there. Since the dinosaurs died out 65Myr ago and the Pleistocene started about 2Myr ago, there can be no connection. Thank you for the opportunity to give you the correct data.

KimW

So you're saying I shouldn't use South Park episodes as the main source of my reasearch?:)

Season 3 - Episode 302 - Spontaneous Combustion

http://southpark-zone.blogspot.com/2008/01/s3-spontaneous-combustion.html

The ant farm mentalities just can't stand to see anyone walk away from their little world and it's shared ether of formic acid.

KimW

"There were a heck of a lot of dinosaurs elsewhere on Earth and NOT in the Americas.'

If I recall correctly, there have been more than a few dinosaurs found in Drumheller and Southern Alberta some in northern Alberta too and I think the far north as well.

Also, I was taught that fossil fuels are the result of large deposits of fossils - namely dinosaurs which accounts for the vast fossil fuels - oil found in Alberta, Northern BC and Saskatchewan...not to mention south of the border - places like Texas and California.

Has this now been discounted or something. Correct me if I am wrong please. I certainly do not want to go on believing old wives tales.

To No-One. Re, " There were a heck of a lot of dinosaurs elsewhere on Earth and NOT in the Americas" means the Chicxulub Event is commonly thought to have "sprayed' incandescent debris all over the North American continent - and a lot of the South Amrican continent and wiped out the American dinosaurs - Hell Creek et al, yet should not have thus affected dinosaurs in other parts of the Earth. To clarify, insert 'just' between 'NOT' and 'in'.

In response to your second question, I did not mention oil and dinosaurs at all, and am at a loss to understand your question. However, I presume that you wish to know the origins of oil. Basically there are two MAIN theories (1) Biogenic - derivation from organic deposits - accumulation of dinosaur carcases is a trivial (small/inconsequential) supposition, and (2) Abiogenic - natural cooking of Methane gas trapped in the Eaths crust at the formation of the planet - see http://basintectonics.blogspot.com/2008/08/abiogenic-oil.html. I trust this answers your concern.

KimW

So, the American dinosaurs died but not the dinosaurs that lived anywhere else when this Chicxulub Event occurred. OK - that makes sense. I thought you were saying there were no dinosaurs in the America's and I consequently gave my head a scratch and wondered what you were talking about. Thanks for clarifying.

As for where fossil fuels come from, I was aware there was another theory but did not know what it was technically. I do now - thanks for the quick lesson. I'm not much of a dinosaur fan; however, I am very interested in archeology and anthropology.