With all due respect Mr.President ... (pdf)
We, the undersigned scientists, maintain that the case for alarm regarding climate change is grossly overstated. Surface temperature changes over the past century have been episodic and modest and there has been no net global warming for over a decade now. After controlling for population growth and property values, there has been no increase in damages from severe weather-related events. The computer models forecasting rapid temperature change abjectly fail to explain recent climate behavior. Mr. President, your characterization of the scientific facts regarding climate change and the degree of certainty informing the scientific debate is simply incorrect.
h/t Bob G.
On the subject of temperature, I believe that for the entire month of March the daily high temperature has never reached average in Edmonton. Any one else notice this?
Calgary has, likewise, been unseasonably cold over the month of March.
Forecasts calling for a hotter than average summer for Canada in 2009.
Obama couldn't give a crap about whether the science is right or wrong. He just sees this as perfect crisis to layer on layers of huge new taxes, grow government intervention in the economy and generally, invoke his socialist vision on America.
Lorraine,
In that case, we had better stock up on sweaters and those snuggly blankets I see advertised on television before there's a run on them.
Posted by Fred:
"Obama couldn't give a crap about whether the science is right or wrong. He just sees this as perfect crisis to layer on layers of huge new taxes, grow government intervention in the economy and generally, invoke his socialist vision on America."
I completely agree. Unfortunately, his vision is quickly becoming reality.
>>Forecasts calling for a hotter than average summer for Canada in 2009.
Forecasts are based on computer modeling which has been shown to be notoriously unreliable. Best to simply look out the window to see if there is still snow on the ground.
.......and those snuggly blankets I see advertised on television before there's a run on them.
Posted by: BoomNoZoom at March 31, 2009 7:04 PM
Dat is one creepy garment!!!!
One more thing. Usually by April 1, except for in the shade, all of the snow is gone. I have at least a foot of snow over the entire lawn and there is more on the way. Oh joy!
Yeah, because the American economy isn't broken enough. Please, Obama, start to dabble in carbon trading schemes and caps - that'll jumpstart things in a hurry.
Then screw the Whitehouse. Let's start turning the Hollywood types. I'm doing my part with all the ones I know.
Keep sending links to this article to your MPP, MP, PMSH, and all local and national news outlets.
The people voted SDA Best Conservative Blog. That means governments have to take action on Conservative values RIGHT NOW.
"Then screw the Whitehouse. Let's start turning the Hollywood types."
You'd have better luck with the Whitehouse. The "Holywood types" need a cause-celebre, and "protecting" the environment is an easy out for them since pretty much any human activity is technically "bad for the environment".
As for the paper Kate linked - it's a nice start, but it won't have any effect either, for the simple fact that very few (if any) of the scientists listed are climatologists. This is the equivalent of having computer-science majors publish an article about neurological diseases. Unless their PhD is in a relevant field, their opinions aren't really relevant.
"I completely agree. Unfortunately, his vision is quickly becoming reality.
Posted by: No-One at March 31, 2009 7:07 PM"
I'm hearing ya man . . . but I remain a complete optimist. . . socialists always eventually run out of other people's money to spend and they can't hide the costs of the various schemes they dream up - eventually the piper demands payment.
Obama and his union puppet masters will screw it up . . . . they are on track, on target and peddling madly towards the edge.
I have faith in Americans being able to see through any snake oil sales man and eventually return to what really matters.
"I have faith in Americans being able to see through any snake oil sales man and eventually return to what really matters."
The reason Obama is so fascinated with Abe Lincoln, besides the fact that he had to go back 150 yrs to find a guy with similar experience, is that he is so proud of proving Abe Lincoln wrong.
I bet he says to his WH bust of Abe every day, "just you watch."
I'm looking out my window in Winnipeg at this very moment, and all I see is Christmas Eve -- nothing but white in the sky.
Alex: That may be true, but it doesn't seem to bother (some) folks that the vast majority of the 'scientists' on the IPCC have nothing to do with climatology either. It's a mighty tough row to hoe just to get back to reasonable debate with many of the most politically inclined AGW proponents.
Fred, you have nailed it. Global warming has been a scam all along. Too bad there are so many useful idiots that have fallen for it, hook, line, and sinker in North America. People are just plain stupid.
Tomorrow, April 1, Al Gore and David Suzuki will announce on CBC that they have just been funnin' us all these last many years. Peter Mansbridge and the Boager will claim they knew that all along.
I have faith that pure science will eventually triumph this political science fiction.
There has never been a time in the earth's history that climate has not changed.
Science and its truthful measures will prove these delusional charlatans wrong.
Google has just started this thing where they show the amount of results that they get from a search.
Kate: 2million+
Warren: 152000
Ah-Hah!
Alex@8.06pm. How do you know that these people have nothing to do with climate? I went back and went through the intire list and as far as I could tell very few listed their specialities.
Do you know all these people? How do you know that most of them have no knowlege of meteroligy?
Perhaps I missed it, but in which newspapers was this ad printed?
Here's another dandy. A good number of the scary sea level projections were based on a reading from a single tide gauge device in Hong Kong. Scientists desperate to show a rising trend jumped all over it and incorporated into their global computer models.
Below is a link to the story, featuring one of the scientists who signed the letter to the President that you posted.
The man has worked in the field for decades and his conclusion is that sea levels haven't moved (either way) in 50 years.
His conclusion is that there is "deliberate ignorance" driving the lie that is feeding the hysteria.
It's good to see that this scam is finally running out of steam. The only downside is that the media were so complicit in the racket that they'll never come clean and say that Gore, Obama and the so-called 'scientists' have no clothes.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/christopherbooker/5067351/Rise-of-sea-levels-is-the-greatest-lie-ever-told.html
Set you free.. By the time "pure science" gets their point across to everyone we will be so far in the financial crap that it will take generations to pay it off. Gore,Suzuki, Mo strong and their gang win the $$ jackpot .
I also love the fact that various lefties are dismissing the report because it was sponsored by the Cato Institute (aka "one of those lunatic right wing organizations that pass for think tanks in America"). Typical lefty response - no facts, just ad hominem attacks. Don't they ever get ashamed?
Oh, but it is an ideal occasion for the American government to grow in size, power and control to say nothing of all the financial benefits to be gleamed from the scam.
Im with Fred at 7:07 pm. Remember in the early 80's when it was stated that the way to even out the global inadequacies was to raise the standard of living in third world countries while simultaneously lowering the standard of living in first world countries? They are working on that now, how do you like it so far. Just trying to raise the standard of living in third world countries didn't work, so we got plan B.
KevinB
'I also love the fact that various lefties are dismissing the report because it was sponsored by the Cato Institute (aka "one of those lunatic right wing organizations that pass for think tanks in America"). Typical lefty response - no facts, just ad hominem attacks. Don't they ever get ashamed?'
Yeah the standard reponse from an AGW lefty to a link which challenges their religion is a simple denounciation of it as a "denier site". done.
Then when you demand to see "the science" they link you to some knob making a declaration of faith, who in turns refers to other knobs making declarations of faith.
Funny thing is criticism of BAMBAM's policys inspires accusations of racism when in reality it is doubtful he has any idea of policy good or bad and is just a puppet for Reid, Pelosi, Frank....
That crowd should tour Dallas.
Obama is worth keeping...if you can only gain control of his teleprompter.
Meanwhile, the villains in the shadows pulling the strings are preparing the FEMA camps to house Obama's core support----unemployed, etc who predictably will riot if Obama fails to deliver the bread and circuses he promised.
It is rumuored that 80,000 troops are currently training in Georgia for civil insurection....
Basically, don't pick on BAMBAM----he is just a puppet MILLI VANNILLI.
Think globally,act locally. We have to use their mantra to defeat them.Whenever you hear someone spew their tired cliches about the enviroment,challenge and/or correct them.I do,and it can be a lot of fun.Also,if you find someone rooting around in your beer fridge in the middle of the night,hurt them.If he/she resembles Suzuki,hurt them again.Do it for the children,because if these fools get their way,our children will live in a world of hurt.
I disagree, wuberman - the standard of living in Korea, China, and India has increased immensely in the last decade. India, for example, saw its nominal GDP grow from $413 billion USD in 1998 to $1.2 trillion USD in 2007. Similarly, China went from $1.1 trillion USD in 1998 to $3.4 trillion USD in 2007. The problem is that because we want to buy everything as cheap as possible, we're losing many manufacturing jobs,and because of the mostly abysmal school systems (thanks NEA and teachers' unions!), we have way too many people here in North America that aren't qualified to do anything that requires substantial brain power. That's your burger flippers! (BTW, my daughters attend the after-school education run by Kumon. When I go to pick them up, I always notice that the class is overwhelmingly Asian - Chinese, Indian, Arab - and that there are very few white or black kids. I have no doubt that Canada will start producing lots of engineering and science grads in the next few years, but I'm also willing to bet most of them will be Asian. For most white kids, learning how to solve partial differential equations at university interferes too much with their drinking.)
Alex writes:
"As for the paper Kate linked - it's a nice start, but it won't have any effect either, for the simple fact that very few (if any) of the scientists listed are climatologists. This is the equivalent of having computer-science majors publish an article about neurological diseases. Unless their PhD is in a relevant field, their opinions aren't really relevant."
Geez Alex, most Canadian "environmentalists" worship a geneticist! Are you saying he's not infallible?
Alex...
No, no, no!
All it takes for a good grasp of AGW or changing-climate or global-warming is a knowledge of reading and arithmetic. An appreciation of graphing would help. That is, not much more than public school.
If the temperature is rising, the numbers, and the line in the graph go upwards. And so they did a bit a decade or so before 1998. But not as much as back in the 1930s, and at earlier times. Checking back a thousand years shows any public-school student that the temperature has fluctuated much more than in the last hundred years.
If the youngster is really keen she can easily see that when she tries to join the dots on a graph with a hockey stick, the blade either goes up at the end, or down. Almost ANY kid understands that it is unfair to use a hockey stick to show how the dots behave.
If a reasonably astute adult (high-school)checks out the World's temperatures and plots them on a graph that also shows Sun-activity (by Sun-spots, say) he will note a curious and very obvious correlation -- going back as far as the records go.
It doesn't take much effort to use the "Al Jezoogle" (I call it) search-engine to find that there is huge opposition to the notion of AGW among scientists, in fact there are thousands upon thousands of scientists who oppose the notion of AGW.
It takes less effort to determine that a lot of the argument these days is not so much about the numbers of climate data. It is, rather, about the heresy of denying what the puppeteers are demanding and controlling.
Goracular dupe-poop is thick and sticky, especially on the hooves in the herd.
Good points Kevin B. Thats why this site is important, people can express their thoughts.
Alex, therein lies the problem of course.
Most climate scientists are brainwashed and have succumb to peer pressure.
Therefore it is not surprising that few of them are willing to go against the tide.
Galileo told the Catholic church they had it all wrong on the planetary system, yet they were considered the "experts" on how it worked. He was the outsider, a fact we find that hard to believe today.
Galileo was right, they were wrong.
At this stage I have more faith in the people outside of climate research circles than I do on those on the inside.
"How do you know that these people have nothing to do with climate? I went back and went through the intire list and as far as I could tell very few listed their specialities."
Because - unlike you - I took the time to do some research. See, I have this bad habit of actually thinking for myself. It sucks. It means that, mos of the time, the conservatives hate me, the liberals hate me, the christians and muslims hate me, and the commies REALLY hate me. Unless I happen to be agreeing with one of those groups - then they're all hugs and smiles for 5 minutes or so, until I point out that there's a bunch of stuff I disagree with them on.
It's just so much easier to be one of the herd, isn't it?
And the Kult Leader , Gore, is a ... a scientist !? A Climotologist ?
How about the proud bearer of a certificate found in a Scientology magazine ?
And our guy Suzuki is scared stiff of Tim Ball - will not even debate. Would get creamed !
TJ:
"Most climate scientists are brainwashed and have succumb to peer pressure."
That's too easy of an out.
If you've got any honesty in you, and if you understand at least a little bit of the science, you have to admit that at least some of what they say makes sense. You and I may disagree with their conclusions, but simply writing them off as deluded or brainwashed is irresponsible, and just plain childish. What we should be pushing for is more research into AGW, not propping up pointless letters written by people who have no qualifications in the field.
Alex I should have known you were a troll.
Spare us with your "Everyone dislikes me therefore I must be right" drivel.
Gord Tulk: "Perhaps I missed it, but in which newspapers was this ad printed?" The ad ran in about five U.S. papers -- NY Times, Los Angeles Examiner, Washington Post, Chicago . . . maybe one other.
"Alex I should have known you were a troll."
Let he who is without hairy toes, cast the first insult.
"Spare us with your 'Everyone dislikes me therefore I must be right' drivel"
Spare me with your "BAAAAH! Conservatives R alwias rait!" drivel.
Alex No, the computer science guys are doing climate change. Garbage in garbage out.
It's easy to say that climate change scientists are crooked, but to their credit, the entire system is geared toward them perpetuating the lie.
Gore's machine is hungry and it feeds on panic. A climate change scientist who doesn't do his/her part to keep the hysteria at Defcon 5 is useless to the cause. Worse, he/she is dangerous and must be silenced to protect the machine.
No one's giving research grants or jobs to those who say the sky isn't falling and the seas aren't rising.
Climate change (formerly global warming) is a means to a politcal and economic end. It has nothing to do with science. After all these years, it appears some can no longer stomach spewing Gore's garbage and are starting to speak out.
Ron; the last time I talked to Tim his comment about the charlatan Suzuki was, the farther up the tree the monkey climbs, the more he shows his ass. The sneaky pervert that hangs out with children in treehouses would never take on Tim one on one, Tim has facts and he is smart and HONEST, that is something no leftie CBC turd can claim, or any other leftie for that matter.
D'you know, I read:
"With all due respect Mr. President (pdf)" as:
"With all due respect Mr. President (pbuh)".
Two of my nightmares seem to be hanging out together.
"Not now Cato, you fool!"
Alex: you say "...for the simple fact that very few (if any) of the scientists listed are climatologists. ... Unless their PhD is in a relevant field, their opinions aren't really relevant..."
Pray tell, what does qualify one as a climate scientist?
How many disciplines does the term climate science even cover?
Off the top of my head I can think of the following disciplines, each of which has many subdisciplines:
1) math
2) physics
3) meterology
4) computer science
5) biology
6) geology
7) oceanography
8) etc
Now, are you going to tell me that a climatologist understands the detail of any one of these disciplines to the same extent as someone who directly studies them??
You need to get a grip here, there is not any single discipline which can lay claim to ownership to the concept of climate science. If you had a clue as to how science works you would understand that it is layered, heavily layered and requires accurate and honest science at all tiers.
Thus to say that someone is not qualified to comment on climate science because they don't have a "climate science" qualification is utterly ridiculous.
Are you sure that people "hate you", maybe they just find you irrelevant!!
At 8:06pm Alex said "As for the paper Kate linked - it's a nice start, but it won't have any effect either, for the simple fact that very few (if any) of the scientists listed are climatologists."
Then at 11:18pm after someone said ""How do you know that these people have nothing to do with climate? I went back and went through the intire list and as far as I could tell very few listed their specialities", Alex replied that "Because - unlike you - I took the time to do some research", presumably to find out for himself.
Got that folks? In one hour and eleven minutes, from the time Kate posted this to the time Alex made his statement, he claims to have checked into the specific backgrounds of close to 100 scientists. That works out to a background check approximately every 42 seconds.
Now that's either an incredible accomplishment on his part or pure bullsh*t to win an argument. The smart money is on the latter.
Not that I want to protect Alex at all, but...
I checked three of the names randomly via Google in less than 2 minutes time and discovered a:
- Marketing Professor (Ph.D.)
- Physicist (Ph.D.)
- Botanist (OBE)
So, Alex's claim as to having checked them out is theoretically valid...and his claim that a majority are not climate scientists MAY be valid.
But:
- I believe that his conclusion that their views are invalid because they are not climate scientists is, in itself, invalid...I concur with Frenchie77's comment; and
- his conclusion that he's right because everyone hates him is also invalid...most everyone hates him because he's likely a jerk.
This list can't be too far out of line, after all the NASA astronomer Jimmy Hansen is classified as a "climate expert" by the equally scientifically papered up "Goracle". Why just the other day that unbiased source of climate info namely CTV Newsnet ran a piece on global warming. The byline was "Climate experts says the earth is warming at an astonishing rate." It turns out that the climate "experts" were that gnarly old hippie/geneticist/climate expert Suzuki and one of his spokesmen. Suzuki solemnly intoned that we just HAVE to have a tax on carbon. Well OK, let's tax carbon. Since Suzuki and his foundation members ALL exude carbon and thereby contribute to the "astonishing" rate of global warming then they could set the example of applying a carbon tax by having their tax exempt status revoked.