Where have all the good men gone?

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/219193

'Goodale said that suggests Harper has the "leadership problem in this country because there is a glass ceiling and whenever he gets close to it, Canadians are repulsed and recoil from the notion that this guy might be close to absolute power."'

That's pretty rich Ralph, this suggests that only LIEberals are allowed to have 'absolute power' in Canada.

Of course the LIEberals exercised absolute power and nearly ran the country into the ground with their Adscam, Income Trust, HRDC, gun registry, insert your favorite scandal, other inane policies.

Oh and what other lovelies happened on the LIEberal watch? Oh yes the RCMP stealing from their own pension plan. They must have learned from their LIEberal masters.

Yes only LIEberals are allowed to be the 'Lord of the Rings' to Her Majesty's plundered treasury.

The precious, the precious, I must have the precious!

If Canadians are repulsed and recoiling, it is at the thought that, the thieves and brigands would once again fly the Jolly Roger, over the the Peace Tower!!

It is unfortunate Ralph, that the LIEberals took a hammer to their own 'glass bottomed boat' and sank it in the Toronto harbour! No?

HMCS Dithers is resting comfortably at the bottom, make sure you take your air tanks, and remember to decompress before you surface.

Senate reform? Why, God forbid, that is the Valhalla for all good Viking plunderers!

Well, he IS Cherny's Reho!

On second thought, could Jason be the MOLE the tories planted?

mucho intrigue...

I
I will be king
And you
You will be queen
Though nothing will
Drive them away
We can beat them
Just for one day
We can be Rehos
Just for one day

And you
You can be mean
And I
I'll drink all the time
'Cause we're lovers
And that is a fact
Yes we're lovers
And that is that

Though nothing
Will keep us together
We could steal time
Just for one day
We can be Rehos
For ever and ever
What d'you say

Broadcasting that you are considered a hero by some people,(or in this case, a reho), is tacky and cheapens the meaning of the word. Real heroes quietly do what they do and don't beg for acknowledgment. Unlike our reho, Dion. I think his ego is out of proportion to reality, big-time.

Not a leader! He isn't even a very good follower, what with his bright anti-capitalism ideas, "stop foreign investment".

Paul Demerais must be having fits, or he's quietly decided a Conservative government may be a better alternative for a while.

If the Conservatives are so good and "getting things done" why are they unable to tell us about it in their own ads? Why are they only focused on the Liberals and Stephane Dion? Aren't they proud of their own, cough cough, ahem, "record"?

Or maybe they are afraid that if they start talking about their record we'll all remember another series of ads from a little while back... "where's the beef?"

I must admit that I was entertained by that Conservative ad. The comments by Dion highlighted in that ad along with the video Cherniak brought forth shows the Libs are becoming, in the words of Gomery, "small town cheap".

To answer your question Ted, the Conservatives are left to pointing out the many flaws in the citizen of France's character and record because the media, somehow, has abdicated balanced jounalism and instead opted for positive bias when it comes to the Liberals in general and Dion in particular.

As far as the Conservative governing record is concerned, they have done more with a minority government than the Liberals ever did with successive majority governments.

But what's the point in pointing anything out to a partisan leftist anyhow?

Irwin:

Dion has been given an even harder time than Harper in the press. The media have only been too happy to repeat/regurgitate Tory talking points about him.

But nice bait and switch.

If you want to whine about the "media bias" myth, then be consistent. If the media isn't telling us about all of the great ways the Conservatives are making Canada a utopia, then why do the Conservatives feel the need to attack Dion in their ads instead of using their ads to tell us about all of these great things?

Truth is they don't because they can't.

They couldn't even complete 5 straightforward priorities, let alone plan a full government agenda.

Where's the beef indeed.

But you are right about one thing. When it comes to flip flops, aboutfaces, lies, reversals, broken promises and abandoned principles... Canada's New-ish-like Government (TM) has indeed accomplished way more in a year and a half than the Liberals did in 13 years. Way to go!!

The thing I forgot to mention Ted, is that Dion is an obvious and embarrassingly weak link for the Liberals, so why not strategically poke at it until it festers and bleeds? It would be remiss if they didn't.

The 'where's the beef' ad you repeatedly refer to was from a Wendy's campaign in 1980/81. Hardly a little while back.

BTW, nothing will ever compare to the Liberals theft of taxpayer money and the many boondoggles the Shawanigan strangler and cohorts committed. Perhaps nothing other than Coderre marching in the streets of Montreal on behalf of Hezbollah.

"BTW, nothing will ever compare to the Liberals theft of taxpayer money and the many boondoggles the Shawanigan strangler and cohorts committed. Perhaps nothing other than Coderre marching in the streets of Montreal on behalf of Hezbollah."

What about the company the Layton crowd is keeping and helping to raise funds?

http://stevejanke.com/archives/228207.php

Ya gotta love Ted.

The Liberals lie, cheat, and steal and Ted falls all over himself to get them elected.

The Conservatives call themselves “Canada’s New Government” … and our man Ted goes into a hissy fit and starts a Facebook petition.

It’s all a matter of priorities, I suppose.

And despite the editors / owners of the newspapers admitting that they are biased, Ted refuses to believe they are biased. Ted and his ilk believe that if a member of the MSM prints something factual about a Liberal, that is bias...but the obvious smears and distortions about a Conservative is balance.

White is black, down is up and wrong is right in when leftists view things through their rose-tinted glasses.

Can't be too hard on Ted. He is simply following Dion's line and, because he has nothing to substantiate the idea that the Conservatives are so bad, he is falling back on the "Harper is a bully" plank.

By the way Ted, why is it that when you Liberals are on the defensive, you seem to forget how politics works? You ask why the Tories are attacking Dion instead of [enter deflection topic here]. The answer is simple, because Dion is an easy target. When your opposition gives you a gift as wonderful as Dion, you exploit it. That's not a Tory thing. The Liberals did it with Stockwell Day (who deserved it) and Preston Manning (who didn't). But, those on the left are not going to whine and cry about it...it's politics.

The Liberals (including Dion) attack Harper's waistline, it's either just good fun or a valid political issue. The Tories attack Dion's past record and current incompetence...they must be deflecting the issues away from themselves, right? Get a life.

The fact that the Libs are falling back to the "Harper is scary" and "Hidden Agenda" line shows how vulnerable they are.

In my last post, where I said...

But, those on the left are not going to whine and cry about it...it's politics

..I meant "right" instead of "left." And I did preview...just missed it.

Just when i think it might be time to cut this twerp some slack, perhaps out of pity, i am reminded of why it isn't.

Did you watch your *reho* just now Ted? There's no concern for a fallen soldier or his family, only partisan attack on a government Minister calling for his termination.

Your *reho* makes me sick, and you're not far behind.

It is kinda sad, really. A year and a half of government, a weak opposition with an apparently weak leader, and the Conservatives still can't come up with a single ad about their own accomplishments or lack thereof.

Where's the beef? There is no beef. That's my beef.

And that is why with all of the powers and money of government at their disposal, with the media regurgitating every talking point of theirs, they haven't moved a bit in public opinion.

Canadians deserve better. Far better.

"Reho". Caught that. ROFL. I hereby dub this new language "manglais".

Speaking of needing a few good men, we need some sitting as Judges. Lefties don't want that though. Proof is below. Remember McMurtry is the one that brought you gay marriage.

Here is the online poll at Toronto radio station CFRB.

The retiring Chief Justice of Ontario's Court of Appeal, Roy McMurtry, tells CFRB News we should never consider electing judges in this country.

How should our judges be selected?

# Your Vote
1. Appointed by governments.
2. Elected by the public.

http://www.cfrb.com/

It's completely obvious why they are striking at Dion -- he's far from an inspiring leader and was a bad choice by the Liberals. But what is more telling is that opinion polls show the Conservatives barely treading water and are perhaps even sinking with such a weak opposition leader. If I were in the Cons position, I'd do the same thing -- emphasize the weakness of your opponent.

I think a few things could boost their popularity:

1) Don't pretend to be a pro-environment party. Yes, do some initiatives to improve it. But no one is going to believe that your heart really is in it if it wasn't a big part of your platform last election and now all you're talking is the environment. The only thing the public hates more than outright lying is being twofaced.

2) Come up with an exit strategy for Afghanistan. I'm not saying exit, but come up with the conditions that are needed for us to leave, a plan to get there and publicize the hell out of what exactly that is.

3) If you want to be really ambitious, come up with a way to reduce gas prices be it through cutting gas taxes or whatever. Yes, you cut the GST and thought it was better spent there but its not as visible as looking at the price on the pump when you fill up. Maybe put some teeth into a watchdog who can really investigate whether or not collusion is occurring.

4) Quit calling it Canada's new government. It's new as a 2 year old newspaper right now. Actually this won't win any points in popularity, but it just irks me everytime I see it.

"Quit calling it Canada's new government. It's new as a 2 year old newspaper right now. Actually this won't win any points in popularity, but it just irks me everytime I see it."

Todd - welcome aboard: sign the petition!

How long have the New Democrats been new, anyway?

I remember in the 2001 BC election, the year of the great NDP slaughter, the party was so ashamed of the name that they advertised as "Today's New Democrats".

NDP?

Never Democratically Picked? Never Deserving Power? Never-neverland Democratic Party? Next Deal for Power?

No Down Payment party, all things for free

You may feel Canadians deserve far better, but as it is, they won't be finding it from anybody in the current Liberal crop. I cannot think of one person who has stood out from the pack and demonstrated real leadership qualities. It's true that I may be biased but it seems to me most of them are too busy playing turtle. Hoping the hare will burn himself out before the end of the race.

I think you only need to take a look at some of advertising's political success stories to understand why the Conservatives are running ads highlighting Dion's weaknesses as opposed to ads offering the kind of self-praise we just heard out of Dion's own self-important mouth.

It's smart politics.

Attack ads work. Even ads as mildly antagonistic as those which the Conservatives have offered. They serve to reinforce a perception (in this case and IMHO, deserved) that Dion is weak, ineffectual, has terrible communication skills in the English language (affecting his ability to appeal to approx. 70% of the Canadian public) and is far too full of himself; a trait that, while likely required by any politician, is as much as possible kept hidden by those who have some semblance of common sense.

I don't know anybody who likes a braggart. Do you? Frankly, if Dion had some of the aforementioned common sense, he'd be waiting for, or perhaps in his case, compelling others to sing his praises. Forget for the moment that he believes himself to be a hero, the optics would be better and the truthfulness of that statement would be much more believable if others, and specifically those others with some political cache, had said it for him . . . repeatedly.

The performance of this minority Conservative government will speak for itself when the time comes. In the meantime, unless they go beyond the bounds of decency, the only harm that is likely to result from an attack on Dion is harm to the Liberal brand. And really, isn't that the point?

If the shoe was on the other foot, I have no doubt whatsoever that the Liberals would be doing the same thing - indeed they did.

From a political perspective, your "beefs" are just plain silly.

I have no "beef" with the Conservatives going negative. If that's all they got, then that's all they got. Clearly they are desperate and need to try to get some traction of any kind with the Canadian public.

I had long arguments with fellow Liberals about the first round of Conservative ads. They were deadly and should have been responded to because they were very effective. These ads? Not so much. Dion is not a leader because he can't make a group of grumpy old men that even the Conservatives whine are unaccountable do the PM's bidding? Hunh? Not only is it a poorly done ad, not only is it repetitious in a boring kind of way from the previous effective ads, but it is a convoluted message, not clear direct and effective like the earlier ones.

Worse, if their point is to be believed, they highlight an inconsistency in the Conservatives policy. The leader of the opposition in the House of Commons SHOULD be able to control the senate and make it do what he wants; HOWEVER, we want an effective senate that is free of partisanship. Again, hunh?

Worse still, they come off as very amateurish but not in the same way as those cheapie mini-ads of the last election. Those were good because they showed a low-budget, "David" campaign against the "Goliath" Liberals campaign (which turned out not to be). Now, we have the Tories repeating over and over how much taxpayer subsidized cash they have, how big and modern their 17,000 sq foot "Death Star" war room is, how competetent they are allegedly... and they produce, after a big announcement with the House Leader and the Senate House Leader hosting, an ad that amounts to basically a "kick me" sign stuck to Dion's back with a blog by a, um, dog. They actually look silly and instead of focusing our attention on Dion, the focus attention on the Conservatives.

Especially with the much better produced, actually funny Young Liberal ads that came out today. Much more professionally done but by amateurs with no money. How's that for a role reversal!

Anyway, like I said, it's not the Conservatives need to go negative that I have a beef with. Those ads actually help the Liberals.

It's the underlying fact that they have no record to sell to the public yet that I have a beef with.

Canadians wanted change in 2006. Instead they get the Right Honourable Brian Jean Paul Harper.

Quite comical for anybody to suggest that any political party put out ads about what they have done. Frankly, the general public have continually shown that ads AGAINST the opposition carry much more weight than the ones that tout success. Every party knows that...even those on the left (who can forget the "soldiers on our streets" ad).

Besides...continually smacking around a staggered opponent is quite simply the way you win any battle.

"Worse, if their point is to be believed, they highlight an inconsistency in the Conservatives policy. The leader of the opposition in the House of Commons SHOULD be able to control the senate and make it do what he wants; HOWEVER, we want an effective senate that is free of partisanship. Again, hunh?"(END QUOTE)

I have no idea what you're on about, but it proves to me that you're simply not bright enough to engage in rational discourse of public policy.

Is it grape or cherry koolaid today?

'Thought it would be fun to turn Ted's lament around:

It is kinda sad, really. [Thirteen years] of government, an [increasingly stronger] opposition with [a few leaders], and the [Liberals] still can't come up with a single [positive thing] about their own accomplishments or lack thereof [because there weren't any].

Where [are the Liberal accomplishments]? There [are] no [Liberal accomplishments]. That's my beef.

And that is why with all of the powers and money of government at their disposal, with the media [as their cheerleaders and not investigating or reporting their scandals until the National Post came along], [the Liberals are trailing the Conservatives] in public opinion.

Canadians deserve better. Far better.

I just saw a Young Leiberal ad trying to mimic the Mac/PC ads. Truly pathetic to say the least. Does anyone remember if Ted complained about the Canadian troops on our streets, with guns? I didn't think so.

So Ted,

About your lack of comprehension.

Is it because you are totally devoid of any semblance of moral or ethical integrity (as proven by your continued support for the most despicable cabal of lying, thieving hypocritical bullies ever foisted upon a democracy)?

Or is it just a general lack of intelligence thing?

A. Cooper:

Since you are obviously processing a little slower today, I'll type slow.

Do the Conservatives want an effective independent senate or just an echo chamber that does the bidding of the MPs?

If the former, then why whine about whether an MP can control senators appointed by past Prime Ministers? If the latter, then why whine on and on about the effectiveness of the senate?

Truth is, there are some deep flaws in the quickly thrown together legislation. The way the Cons drafted this, what happens at the end of the term? A PM gets to stack all senate openings with partisans. Clearly that's an error and makes a bad partisan problem worse. So why are the Cons refusing all amendments?

Actually, Texas, I did criticize the Liberals about the guns in our streets non-ads. They were stupid and offensive.

Pd: thanks for showing up and proving the rule: as an online discussion grows past two comments, the probability of a Conservative ignoring the substance of a discussion and making personal insults instead approaches one. What a bunch of whiners some of you are.

Been around the block:

Oooooh. That's clever. Keep it up. Remember the rule: whenever someone criticizes the Conservatives for their gross lack of accountability, transparency, competence, principle or solid record... just whine that the Liberals were worse. That kind of avoidance of responsibility is exactly what you need to convince the 77% of Canadians who did not vote for you that you have real leadership.

Honestly, the best thing that Dion has going for him is Harper, but the only thing Harper has going for him is Dion.

You know, it's too bad really. A lot of Canadians were prepared to follow Harper as evidenced by those now-long ago polls. If he had tried to be a leader, tried to be a leader of all Canadians, instead of the petty obsessive angry partisan hack, I have no doubt whatsoever that he would have a majority right now. Unfortunately, it just isn't in his nature. No surprise though, career politicians rarely are true leaders.

Come up with an exit strategy for Afghanistan. I'm not saying exit, but come up with the conditions that are needed for us to leave, a plan to get there and publicize the hell out of what exactly that is.

I more or less agree with this. I support the mission for a number of reasons, but the Tories have hardly done a good job of clearly articulating what the "official" mandate is, and they're catching hell for it on a daily basis. Don't let those bien pensant jackasses at the G&M and in the Opposition benches frame the debate!

I did not suggest that your beef was with the Conservatives going negative, but rather questioned your complaint (beef) with the Conservatives not going positive about their own performance.

My response to you was essentially, "Why should they?" Negative ads are known to work. Positive ads/posturing (and I provided my rationale as to why I don't believe this works as well) are not as effective. The question is therefore, why is it that you have any beef with any political party using the most effective method of boosting their party's fortunes? The answer is self-evident, but it is the very reason why the Conservatives have chosen to continue to attack Dion's leadership qualities. There is some truth to the premise and it will hurt the Liberal brand.

I would suggest that Liberals who are interested in boosting their party's standings in public perception, take the time to figure out how they might accomplish this task, rather than whining about how the current minority government is neglecting to focus on its own performance. But, hey, if that's your only strategy, run with it. We'll see how far it gets you.

It's somewhat like my daughter blaming me for the loss of a lunch bag on the bus because I called her at the wrong moment. That may have been the case, but the only one who suffered was the one who didn't have any lunch to eat that day.

Just as I suspected.......it's the lack of intelligence thing.

You bring it on yourself Ted. Back up at the top of this thread, Irwin told you exactly why the attack ads are out. And you've posted nothing but hypocritical lies and spin ever since. And nobody is buying it.

Are you some sort of masochist Ted? You repetedly come to this site to spew your nonsense and every time you get your ass handed back to you on a platter. It's not like you ever contribute anything worthwhile. (of course I guess it's tough when your party has no policies) And if anyone is in need of a dose of Lieberal lies and hypocricy, all they have to do is turn on the tv or pick up a newspaper.

I must be a bit of a masochist Pd. I come over here to discuss issues, strategy, and I do so with respect for other commenters (though not this sorry ass excuse for a government) and civility, and I always am guaranteed to get in response the kind of juvenile name calling you demonstrate.

I feel like a missionary in an alien land of savages sometime.

A missionary in an alien land of savages?

sounds a bit racist to me

Conservatives do not constitute a race cal2.

"I feel like a missionary in an alien land of savages..."

Are you a victim or reho Ted?

Gee Ted, you must have been shining your halo too much. Because somewhere along the line you have taken 13 years of nothing other than scandal and entitlement mentality and turn it into gold, although you are much better at it than your leader.
I realize you ride for the brand and admire loyalty but please don't expect us to swallow all that stuff as truth. Maybe Cretien's imaginary homeless guy but not most conservative thinking people.

Well, let's apply Ted's logic to his own beloved Liberal party. After 13 years in power did they run ads showing what great things they had done for the country?

Nope! We were treated to army's in our cities, a woman cowering on the floor, a gun pointing in our face and firing. Images of Stephen Harper alongside Mike Harris and George Bush.

I'm not making this up. I'm not allowed to.

And Ted, be honest. The only reason Liberal's are not running their own attack ads is because of money, or lack of.

To get to the guts of the topic - are the ads going to do what they are intended to do? We don't think so. Why did they target the issue of leadership when this is an factor Harper is already way ahead on? Where is the margin to be won? If it aint broke don't fix it. They should be targeting an issue which the Conservatives feel they need to convince voters about, an issue on which they are weak. Doesn't make sense to us and we feel these attack may backfire. We too would have liked to see something that promoted the positives. There are some you know. There is a swing vote out there willing to come over if the Conservatives don't "turn them off". Someone is giving bad advice. Someone has said Mulroney. Don't know about that.

Paulstuff: Actually you are wrong. The Liberals started the campaign off with about 6 ads on the theme of 1001 reasons to vote Liberal. Kate even profiled one of them on this very blog. Of course, the media had decided they wanted Harper to win so you never heard about it, but thems the breaks.

The value of an advertisement is not whether it is negative or positive, it is whether it is effective given a specified goal, either moving votes or setting up a secondary campaign by for eg. softening up your opponent. As I said up above, and as ww notes, the earlier Con ads were deadly effective and you had the media eating out of your hands. These ads just aren't effective. In fact, they are earning mockery, especially the silly dog blog - funny idea, but awful execution to the point where you remember the awful execution and not the ad content.

And they look particularly whiny and juvenile compared to the Liberal kids who put together the mock PC/Mac ads that were launched today.

And it ain't just me.

Here's one of the many Tories knocking the Tories (that's getting to be a very familiar event these days):
________________

What did you expect?
Isn't this the third time attack ads have been launched? Fourth?

Honestly, if the Liberals didn't launch counterattack ads...

... I wouldn't know what to say.

Know what'd be nice? If the Tories proposed some new goddamned ideas instead of telling me that Dion isn't leader material.

Listen, goddammit: I can see Dion's not a leader by the way he flip flops on every goddamned issue. I can see he's not a leader by his inability to leave his stamp on the party except by blunt force. I don't need millions in Tory money to beat the obvious into me.

But if leadership is their game, leaders don't sit there and merely point out their opponents' flaws. Hein?

(N.B.: If the Tories feel absofrickinglutely compelled to launch ads, why not do something that pushes conservatism?

Here's an example. I've been playing crack-on-three-CDs a lot recently, and the quote for the technology of environmentalism is, "We do not inherit the earth from our parents but borrow it from our children." What better way to push debt, for example, than by using that kind of logic? That kind of thing. But, like, what the f--- do I know? I'm just an informed voter.)

Ted, get over it, ya lost man.

The Conservatives have been in semi-power, (minority) for about 14 months. How could they possibly done all this damage you and your ilk are accusing them of under the watchful eye of your Party sitting in Official Opposition?
IMPOSSIBLE.
It really gets pretty desperate when all the Opposition can harp on is George Bush, who has nothing to do with the Conservative Party of Canada aside from getting along as a trading partner and neighbor. Then harp on about the Afghanistan mission which Chretien signed on to without debate.

How about talking about 13 years of Majority government resulting in out of control patronage and entitlements and toss in a few scandals and boondoggles and the biggest in the history of the country called the Sponsorship scandal.

GET STUFFED.

Liz: I don't think Harper is destroying Canada. He's not getting anything done and has no plan to so how could he destroy Canada. I focus on his lack of accountability, his many broken promises and lies, his flip flops, his lack of transparency, his juvenile petty partisanship, his disdain for ordinary Canadians.

And I've never compared Harper to Bush so I have no idea what you are talking about when you say "all" that we harp on is Bush. In fact, Harper has given Canadians plenty to complain about in 16 months of power without any such comparisons. Ironically, he might be doing better if he'd have just parrotted Bush: at least then he could claim to being (a) consistent with his past published statements and (b) he would have kept his base happy.

"Conservatives do not constitute a race cal2.

Posted by: Ted at May 30, 2007 6:46 PM "

And neither do wops,scuz Indians,wetbacks, whatever Ted. We are all one race!!!! It's called homo sapiens. So why would anyone bring out the "race" card? I would call them a "culturalist",because that is what they are afraid of. But then, calling someone a culturalist doesn't have quite the same PC impact.
Or how about "moralist"? I know I sure a h%%l hate the morals of thieves,murders,and other assorted scum. But again,same point as culturalist. Reminds me of the old saying...RACIST...someone winning an argument with a leftard.