One generally gets the sense that mental giants such as this emerge from their calculations as theoretical members of the “survivor” percentage.
[T]here was a gravely disturbing side to that otherwise scientifically significant meeting, for I watched in amazement as a few hundred members of the Texas Academy of Science rose to their feet and gave a standing ovation to a speech that enthusiastically advocated the elimination of 90 percent of Earth’s population by airborne Ebola. The speech was given by Dr. Eric R. Pianka (Fig. 1), the University of Texas evolutionary ecologist and lizard expert who the Academy named the 2006 Distinguished Texas Scientist.
Something curious occurred a minute before Pianka began speaking. An official of the Academy approached a video camera operator at the front of the auditorium and engaged him in animated conversation. The camera operator did not look pleased as he pointed the lens of the big camera to the ceiling and slowly walked away.
This curious incident came to mind a few minutes later when Professor Pianka began his speech by explaining that the general public is not yet ready to hear what he was about to tell us. Because of many years of experience as a writer and editor, Pianka’s strange introduction and the TV camera incident raised a red flag in my mind. Suddenly I forgot that I was a member of the Texas Academy of Science and chairman of its Environmental Science Section. Instead, I grabbed a notepad so I could take on the role of science reporter.
Otherwise, the question bears asking – what’s holding you back, Dr. Pianka? Sure, it’s a slower process than you’re advocating, but you know – the journey to homo sapiens planetary purity begins with that first step in front of a bus.
Time to lead by example, dear doctor.
Update – Pianka responds after a fashion.
Udate – April 5 – Pianka’s Biology 304 course evaluations – scroll down to this “dissenting” opinion from 2004;
Though I agree that convervation biology is of utmost importance to the world, I do not think that preaching that 90% of the human population should die of ebola is the most effective means of encouraging conservation awareness. I found Pianka to be knowledgable, but spent too much time focusing on his specific research and personal views.
Via Ed Minchau who has lots more.
Maybe the good professor should start saving the planet by a selfless act of self-removal.
Start the good deeds at home.
What do you expect from a “lizard expert”?
Hear…hear Kate. I get so damn sick of those that say the earth is overpopulated.
Stop being part of the “problem”
Another Peter Singer wannabe. If ebola doesn’t quite work out, look for the good doctor to endorse active euthanasia of young and old, predicated on ‘quality of life,’ no doubt measured by the those who ‘know what’s best’ for us.
Eugenics. Hitler would be proud.
Surley the ultimate in self disgust-move over joe&adolph your exponentially grown offspring are here!
In reading Forrest Mims (sorry,
Forrest M. Mims “the IIId”) account, Mims seems to be stretching the truth and doing a heck of a lot of editorializing. When you strip away the opinionizing, it seems more that Pianka is giving dire warning of what he believes (and most do not) to be a monumental problem in the world; it does not seem like he is actually advocating the killing of billions. More in the “if we don’t do anything, the only way we could survive is if billions die” line of thinking. The same old scaremongering to produce change we’ve seen from left and right, but not advocating of genocide.
Agree or disagree on the issue of over-population being a problem, and whether Pianka and other scientists are nuts for supporting the idea, but clearly Mims disagrees with over-population as an issue and, instead of debating or even attacking the message, he heaps on the hyperbolic misconstruing and attacking of the messenger.
Pianka’s own hyperbole aside, increasingly scarce resources and rapidly increasing populations is an (please note the singular of the word “an”) issue that governments do need to grapple with more thoroughly. The problem is that the issue gets lost in the polarized and politicized positioning of the Piankas and Mims of the scientific, political and religious worlds.
Ted
Cerberus
Wasn’t this the plot of the Tom Clancy novel “Rainbow Six”?
IMO, the scary part is not the ideas of this crackpot, but the fact that no one called him on it.
Too many people are afraid to voice what they worry may be an unpopular opinion to avoid an uncomfortable situation.
First, he says that we are no better than bacteria and then portrays lower world IQ as a problem. If we are no better than bacteria, what is the difference what our IQ is.
I do not know his details, but in my own experience, too many people associate IQ with education and knowledge. I have met many educated people in my life and a short conversation can usually tell you if they are smart or merely educated.
Trev
While Pianka’s methods are undesirable, the message is important – there are too many of us and we use too many resources. The Earth;s carrying capacity is being stretched and our pop. is continuing to sky-rocket and people are becoming richer all the time (think China), using more resources. I for one don’t look forward to a planet with 10 billion plus people – where will we find the land to feed all these people? How about the energy?
I long ago noted that some biologists dislike and are uncomfortable with their fellow human beings. That may well be a reason why they went into biology in the first place. Some, doubtless, would be happy if 90% of us were to be killed off. That is a good reason to take biologists’ advice with caution.
This topic reveals the truth about leftists. Anyone–ANYONE–leaning even ever so slightly (yes you, ted and peter) towards supporting these dangerous and DEADLY ideas needs to think HARD about publicly admitting this:
“I believe Hitler, Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot were right, they just didn’t get to finish the job.”
End of debate.
“While Pianka’s methods are undesirable, the message is important – there are too many of us and we use too many resources.”
While Hitler’s methods were undesirable, the message is important – there were too many Jews and they used too many resources.
Interesting how the substitution of a few key words can go such a long way.
Pianka is a crank, a crackpot and an all-round unpleasant bit of business.
As are all those who hint at, or suggest, or imply the wholesale liquidation of their fellow human beings in pursuit of some cause. They deserve revulsion, shaming and rejection.
So much for “scientific humanism.”
Well… anyone that believes our current course of growth at all costs and rabid consumption is sustainable is an idiot. I wouldn’t advocate deliberate depopulation, but nature is sure as hell going to do it for us at some point.
End of debate.
To inject a little humor (and light) on the topic:
It’s nice to know that liberal academia is now stealing their ideas from 1970’s Batman cartoon villians.
To quote PJ O’Rourke, the good prof and his supporters are in the:
“We need a lot more of me and a lot less of you”
gang.
I support a close eye being put on him and every one who has indicated support for the strategy.
Hardliner nailed it. Mother Nature will remove us if we get to over-populated for the system. It happens everyday in the real animal world, of which we are a part of.
Nice spinning Hell Dog
“Pianka’s own hyperbole aside”
But why should we ignore his hyperbole? His words speak loud and clear how feels about humans and what needs to be done.
” He told a story about how a neighbor asked him what good the lizards are that he studies. He answered, “What good are you?”
…….”We’re no better than bacteria!”
……..quick steps must be taken to restore the planet before it’s too late.”
A certain Austrian painter had similar view about certain people. He obviously didn’t have a grand a world view as Dr. Piankas.
What’s most disturbing is that he was given an award and a ” …. loud, vigorous and enthusiastic applause.”
Cerberus- “The problem is that the issue gets lost in the polarized and politicized positioning of the Piankas and Mims”
Your attempt at making a moral equivalence between a man that sees people no better than bacteria and a man finds the very idea of that appalling, is very revealing.
To all those of you who feel that the world has too many people, I invite you to throw your children in front of a moving train, then step under the wheels yourself. If you think “too many people” is a problem, then become a part of the solution yourself. And leave me and mine out of it.
Ed:
Amen to that.
Overpopulation is the eight hundred pound gorilla sitting in the global corner.
If you zoom out a bit an take a good look at the state of humanity at this time in history … There is no reason to have so many of us. Like anything else when you have an over abundant supply of anything it becomes cheap. Life has become lot cheaper in recent times.
It might also be interesting to note, in regard to dropping IQs. All the technology and advancements we enjoy in the western world today were invented or conceptualized before 1950. I will name a few … Nuclear fission computers, jet engine/rockets, insulin and antibiotics, internal combustion, banking systems, lasers, television, advanced mathematics, IE Einsteins theories, most of our great literature and classical music and Jazz… a system of mass education that actually educated. I could go on … but I think I made the point.
In the last fifty years or so, all that has been done is improve upon those previously invented or developed things. During the same time much has been denigrated or watered down to be almost meaningless such as our educational system.
NOTHING NEW since 1950 .. at least nothing profound. So why are we here? Diversity might be a reason, but only at the expense of the elimination of much other diversity. I do believe that the human being is the most important life form on the planet in as much as it’s only one that can study itself and all other things. And that is aware of the Universe itself.
However, such an audience is not required. I would prefer a small attentive audience to a mammoth unruly mob at my concert any day! Dr. Pianka asserts that if most of us don’t die soon, most of will all eventually. Sound silly when you say that way.
His claim that the earth won’t survive with human poplulation growth is nonsense. The Earth is a ball in space and there isn’t much we can do to change that. It’s human life on Earth that he fears won’t survive (unless will kill most of it ASAP). After we are gone (by whatever means) the earth’s immune systems will kick in to play and after a couple of million years … Presto … A beautiful pristine blue green ball will be available to whatever arises next.
Dr. Pianka selfishly wants the be around to witness the future. Perhaps he would do well to eat less and exercise more and take in as much as his sorry life will allow.
I personally have a low regard for humanity in general mainly because we seem to be the only species capable of hate, cruelty, murder, deceipt and a bunch of other bad things that your dog would never even consider.
As horrid as it sometimes seems, nature will taking it’s course with or without the help of this global Dr. Cavorkian.
I did some quick research, and I have to say I doubt that Ebola would work in the same way the mad doctor hopes it would.
That said, he’s still a disgusting fool, and the crowd that applauded him instead of booing him off the stage doubly so.
Pianka It seems is leading the charge for global genocide.
To all those idiots who think where overpopulating the planet, look at the data. Demographicaly where going extinct!!
More Western academic, loathing of Western Deomcacy.
I bet the bad eugenics Prof. ( This theory is as old as the hills & has never worked. How do know? Because in Alberta we listened to nuts like this & are now paying 1/2 a bllion rightfly to those who where sterilised until 1970 by color , crimnality or metal aquity.)thinks he will escape. The fact they want to hide it from the masses , as they see it. Is itself a clue too the monsterious nature of there theory’s.
What disturbs me is there idea where not even worth bacteria. Perhaps this is the bad Dr’s tuurn to think that if where not worth spit nether is he & his theories.
Overpopulation is a myth.Perpatrated by anti Western fanatics. Do you ever here them revial India or china? You liberals are in love with what you see as Belle Morte. For those less evolved than you , right? Abortion, euthanasia, mercy klling, quality of life murder. All tools nb the socialist liberal tool kit of death.
“All the technology and advancements we enjoy in the western world today were invented or conceptualized before 1950.”
Including this very Internet that allows people like you to blow hot air out to the world?
JJM
What’s your point?
What a nut job… wow, that’s left me almost speachless.
Reminds me of a conversation I had with a neighbor of mine who’s renting his home.
He told me he was holding off from buying a home. Apparently he’s waiting to see if bird-flu becomes a pandemic, because if it does and 10-15% of the population dies, realty prices will go down (which does make some sense — supply and demand).
As he was telling me his theory, all I could think to say was “Yeah, sure, as long as you’re not one of the one’s that dies“.
Some people seem to think they’re too good and smart to die.
A lot of those people contradict themselves, by being athiests but also beliving they’ll be “magically” protected.
The people who support the dear Prof., & he himself, would never advocate they themselves would become part of the “solution”. They’re like socialists who are always quick to share everyone’s wealth but their own.
Hmm…
Kate’s right. We should stay on subject.
I think Ed Minchau’s posting nicely encapsulated my feelings on the matter.
‘Nuff said.
All you overpopulation-chicken-littles—I’ll give you the time of day when you can decalre that you would be willing to sacrifice your own children for the sake of your cause.
“NOTHING NEW since 1950 .. at least nothing profound.”
So Duke, are you pounding out your posts on an IBM Selectric and sending them by Canada Post?
“I personally have a low regard for humanity in general mainly because we seem to be the only species capable of hate, cruelty, murder, deceipt and a bunch of other bad things that your dog would never even consider.
Ever seen a cat play with a mouse or a killer whale play volleyball with a baby seal or see a gopher run into a neighbouring hole to render first aid to another, winged by a 22?
This latent self loathing by so many humans, for the last couple of hundred years is taking it’s toll.
“‘Spirit,’ said Scrooge, with an interest he had never felt before, ‘tell me if Tiny Tim will live.’
‘I see a vacant seat,’ replied the Ghost, ‘in the poor chimney-corner, and a crutch without an owner, carefully preserved. If these shadows remain unaltered by the Future, the child will die.’
‘No, no,’ said Scrooge. ‘Oh, no, kind Spirit! say he will be spared.’
‘If these shadows remain unaltered by the Future, none other of my race,’ returned the Ghost, ‘will find him here. What then? If he be like to die, he had better do it, and decrease the surplus population.’
Scrooge hung his head to hear his own words quoted by the Spirit, and was overcome with penitence and grief.
‘Man,’ said the Ghost, ‘if man you be in heart, not adamant, forbear that wicked cant until you have discovered What the surplus is, and Where it is. Will you decide what men shall live, what men shall die? It may be, that in the sight of Heaven, you are more worthless and less fit to live than millions like this poor man�s child. Oh God! to hear the Insect on the leaf pronouncing on the too much life among his hungry brothers in the dust!'”
Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol
“–I’ll give you the time of day when you can decalre that you would be willing to sacrifice your own children for the sake of your cause.”
I don’t think it’s right to lay it on the offspring.
There’s been too much of that already for a certain cause.
Here’s my 15 tonne challenge:
I challenge all the pinheads that have swallowed the Kyoto wealth redistribution sheme of saving the world by making millions of dollars of payments to our direct competators ( and private carbon credit traders), to dig their way out from under a 15 tonne steaming heap of Liberal Bovine fecial matter (1 tonne a daya day for 15 days) by educating themselves on the subject of the proposed koyoto implelentaion plan.
It is my experience that all those who reflexively promote Kyoto solutions have never read the Kyoto plan and its supporting research documents containing the core threat ( which is still a theory in dispute) and core solutions ( thich is a tax regime based on carbon production). Once you remove the hype and political BS from your eyes, you realize that the carbon taxing regime proposed by Kyoto has Zero potential to effect air-borne toxins or environmental pollution and even less to eleviate the so-called carbon gases which the environment produces naturally.
Take the challenge, step out from under the 15 tonnes of BS 😉
Cal (12:15): Your attempt at making a moral equivalence between a man that sees people no better than bacteria and a man finds the very idea of that appalling, is very revealing.
No, I’m not making any moral equivalence. I’m not saying the overstated, chicken-little hyperbole of Pianka, saying that the world is on the brink of monumental disaster, is the same as the overstated genocide hyperbole of Mims and other conservatives (as demonstrated here; BTW, does Godwin’s Law ever kick in around here?).
All I’m saying is that with all of the hyperbole, polarizing and politicizing of the issue, we ignore the fact that at root there is an issue that society needs to grapple with: the fact that our resource base is diminishing while our populations are increasing.
Conservatives seem afraid to even talk about the issue. To just discuss the issue is not even to take a position on population control so relax Doug, others. It is more to focus attention on the need for newer technologies to get more out of our resources, to perhaps even scale back our own consumption of resources (which I realize is far more anathema for conservatives than genocide – there, that’s my addition to the stupid partisan hyperbole). It’s just as likely that the discussion of the problem of matching resources and needs could inspire a smart risk-taking entrepreneur to develop some sort of food product or growing technique.
Instead, the left is content to and prefer to keep telling us we are, yet again, on the precipice of imminent natural disaster and conservatives are, yet again, content to and prefer to sit back and demonize a made-up image of liberals because it makes them feel righteous.
At least with the internet, the idiocy of both is on full display for the entertainment value of the rest of us.
Ted
Cerberus
In my post I never advocated the killing of anyone, I simply stated that over-population is a problem and will continue to be. Look at the world’s ecosystems – they are straining under the pressure and will only get worse the more people are born into this world. I would never advocate the systematic killing of others, but we do need to start dealing with the issue. How do we do this? Well for starts, we need to reduce the amount of resources we use (efficency and conservation) and perhaps down the road, if the pop. keeps spiraling out of control we need to think about limitng the # of children people have. I know, I know. Many of you will freak out. That’s fine. But either we start to limit our pop. or mother nature will do it for us. And no, I haven’t advocated killing one person, so quit saying that I am.
Pork rinds for Allah from now on.
Me too.. we are all doomed. Rats are immune.
As “they” say, charrr-ity begins at yer BBQ. +
Barbecue meats linked with prostate cancer(Oh no! I’m doomed!)
Posted by Neville72
On 04/03/2006 9:10:30 AM PDT � 57 replies � 851+ views
Reuters/Yahoo News ^ | 4/3/2006 | Staff
WASHINGTON (Reuters) – A compound formed when meat is charred at high temperatures — as in barbecue — encourages the growth of prostate cancer in rats, researchers reported on Sunday. Their study, presented at a meeting of the American Association for Cancer Research, may help explain the link between eating meat and a higher risk of prostate cancer. It also fits in with other studies suggesting that cooking meat until it chars might cause cancer. The compound, called PhIP, is formed when meat is cooked at very high temperatures, Dr. Angelo De Marzo and colleagues at Johns Hopkins University in… + more…
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1608315/posts
This guy is a typical socialist Elitist with delusions of intelligence. His is an hoary old theory that has caused unbelievable pain for almost a century. Mega deaths as a result.
Eugenics are based on unsound principles. If the Moron would look at world Demographics. He would see Western Nations are going extinct except the liberals hated America. Europe is ding culturally & physically. The birth rate is causing social upheaval. His solution . Mass Murder. After all this would destroy the hated conservative.
A license too kill any who disagree in the name of population control. It allows these fantasists to think like pol pot that a new world can be brought about. Run by academics. The philosopher kings mentality. Kill off 90% of people like they where lice.
Belle Morte. The liberal socialist ideal. Kill , abort, euthanasia, mercy kill. Death to liberals is a sweet thing unless its there own or folks on death row who share the same humanist values. None.
Its also a way to kill despised democracy by these ivory tower humanists. They so love communism or any despotic system. That would kill them off first.
That they tried to silence this information. Shows they know the horrors this would unleash. There hiding something. This guy is a dangerous fruitcake. Considering it seems the libs on this board think this guy is just tickity boo. Here is some info on this budding hustler of genocide.
Go to his site. Man I wonder when this dude ever gets off the high pedestal he resides on. Another narcissist wedded to Darwinian stupidity.
If I remember right in school. By now we should have had 20 billion people . Yet since 1947 fertility rates have plummeted. D these fools ever think that Nature has its own mechanism to deal with overpopulation. That man is above this is a conceit?
I forgot to add . If Ralph wanted to leave a real legacy instead of Crietianite one. He should set up a resourse program like Alaska. He would be remembered for a long long time.
It amazes me that he would hurt his own party by staying on as a lame duck for almost 2 years. Its infantile.
That said. Alberta owes a lot to Klien. He did stick to his guns on important issues, & better yet. United many Albertans as a people in there own right. An example was the rebate checks. No matter your stand on this. It unified this Province in one stroke.As did most of us who took a 4% decress in wages for the Childrens future of this Province. So they would not carry our follies with them into there future.
He’s made mistakes but than he’s human & every 9 months on TV it seems he’s appologizing. Who else in this Nation has done so? None & nobody.
At least he stands accountable. Sad though to see he’s become like a treasured guest, who has stayed over his welcome.
I personaly will regret his barn burning begining & saving us from the abysss.
Nothing new or conceptualized since 1950, eh?
Well, what’s your point? Everything up until the 1950s was refining ideas invented/conceptualized by 1815.
…Including the doomsday theory that you work off. (Malthusianism)
Maurice Strong has advocated for “depopulation” too.
and again, perhaps he could lead by example…
First off, Dr. Eric R. Pianka should save the planet by hanging himself. We don�t need to kill anyone. Education will lower the birth rate world wide. It is not the western world that is causing over population. Capitalism will develop fusion, or something like it. Using our minds the human race will move first to the moon then mars. I think Pluto would be a good place for killer lefties.
“It is not the western world that is causing over population.”
No, but we are using much more resources than those in the 3rd world and that is the basic problem. It isn’t neccesarily over-pop. per se, but the fact that we have such a large global pop. using so many resources.
Sadly, this is the logical conclusion made by many evolutionary humanists. When human life is no more valuable than bacteria, why not advocate for a cull to make one’s own life better? Survival of the fittest and all that rot…
“Sadly, this is the logical conclusion made by many evolutionary humanists.”
Rudester: could you please provide a citation or a link for anyone who believes in evolution and believes in human culls.
Thanks.
Just post the link in a comment or send it to me at:
Ted
Cerberus
“I invite you to throw your children in front of a moving train, then step under the wheels yourself.”
Ed, Why punish the kids because they have the misfortune to have freaking idiots for parents?
I’ve heard a few people start down the “too many people, gotta cull some” road and everytime I’ve suggested they show some leadership and off themselves, I get a response which boils down to “There’s way too many black/brown/yellow people, they’re the ones I’m talking about.” Fans of decreased populations are racists, plain and simple.
Yes, we are using many resources oil being the worst. But, we will inovate. We do not need to cull anyone. Education will set us free. PS Evolution is a fact, how it works is a theory. Just because it is a fact does not mean people do not have the free will to overide it. For those of you that believe in the bible, humans ate from the tree of knowledge, we can do good or evil, with that knowledge. Dr. Eric R. Pianka is evil.
Dr. Eric R. Pianka, treats all races, dead equal.
“I’ve heard a few people start down the “too many people, gotta cull some” road and everytime I’ve suggested they show some leadership and off themselves, I get a response which boils down to “There’s way too many black/brown/yellow people, they’re the ones I’m talking about.” Fans of decreased populations are racists, plain and simple.”
Please don’t lump us all in together. That’s part of the problem. Instead of reading these comments, most of you have made up your mind and see people who view population as a serious see as some sort of homogenous group. It’s not about offing people, its about using less resources and educating people to ensure that our pop. does not continue to increase as fast as it is. What’s so freaking racist about that?
Rudester: could you please provide a citation or a link for anyone who believes in evolution and believes in human culls.
How about Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot just to name a few. Numerous other leaders have placed human life on the same level as animals and behaved in similar ways. And it makes sense if you believe that we are no more than highly organized pond scum.
Just to inject a little extra fuel on the fire:
In the democratic countries of North America and Europe, much has been made lately of the demographic demise of the white people who started those countries; their birth rates are below replacement value, whilst those of recent, mostly differently coloured, immigrants are much higher. So, for those who are worried about the impact of over-population, if everyone emulated the model of white people, we wouldn’t have a problem – population would be shrinking.
(s/ So maybe the dear doctor just wants to rid the world of all the smelly brown people /s).
Rudester: So all of the hyperbole is not about anyone you can point to now? So why link and compare those who would discuss limited resources and population growth as a source of problems in the world to those monsters of the past? Those conservatives who do not even want to discuss the issue, as demonstrated here, are quick to talk about Hitler, Stalin, eugenics, but it seems to me to be all a lot of hot air intended to avoid discussing the problem.
No one – no one – is suggesting culling humans to address the problem of resources, but your reliance on a disgusting strawman is pretty revealing.
Ted
Cerberus