Bannock, Beer And Spirit Names

83 Replies to “Bannock, Beer And Spirit Names”

1. All the services within 3km of the Peace Tower are available to that cultural group.
   “Society of Unloved Liberals.”
   anyway the dept of Indian affairs is a bureaucracy second only to the Vatican. but the Vatican has a 1000 year lead on the native mess.

2. Unrelated, but interesting: http://www.sorrynorwaydenmark.com/

3. What if they’d given every household in that 3km $50,000 each instead? (If anything, the beer and popcorn stores would do well).

4. …I know – “Brocket 99″…

5. Cheers.
   ’bout time someone said it.
   But don’t believe all the hype. Most of the natives I know work the grind, and come out A-O.K in the absence of tax…

6. Having lived up in the Cold Lake area with three reserves and a handful of Metis’ ones all around, it is quite interesting to be there around the 15th and 30th.
   Forgot about powwow days.
   I had a native friend confide in me that it is hard to get off the reserve because so many are jealous of him. Following “white man’s trash” or “traitor”, etc he’s been accused of.
   I could go on and on, but I don’t want remember the things I saw, like brand new cedar sided homes torn to bits for, get this, firewood, within a year’s time.
   I think like Bill Crosby said, until they get off the “victim mentality” bandwagon as well clean up the corruption within the band council (you think the Liberals were bad), we will continue to have this big elephant around our necks as a nation.
   Gee almost sounds like Quebec. ‘Have not’ province, distinct society, injustice done by Les Anglais.

7. That list….. Excuse me whilst I pick my jaw up outta my lap! At times like this, I am soooo tired of being 3rd generation white middleclass. The only problem is, if I cry “victim” I get told to “suck-it-up”! *sigh* My kingdom (such as it is) for a level playing field.

8. Many aboriginals, myself included, are rebelling against the entitlement dependence foisted upon us. Don’t fault the smart ones for playing the hand they’ve been dealt, help the real smart ones change the system to eliminate the dependence. Remember the sanctity of property rights and take the time to extend that back to when the aboriginals were indeed the legitimate owners of this land we call Canada. As an original Reformer and long suffering Director for my Calgary East MP, I’ve found a positive way to respect my Metis heritage by helping to turn the resentment my non-aboriginal fellow conservatives feel into an honest look at how true conservative beliefs can provide an honest reconciliation. Aboriginals, a short 400+ years ago, lived a comfortable and relatively peaceful life on the very lands we’ve now built our cities upon. It is much more our fault than theirs that we’ve been unsuccessful in helping them achieve the same living standards we all now enjoy so it is obviously our responsibility to address the current problems.

9. Hey,
   Sorry, can someone help me out here. I didn’t get the link between the article linked to, the list, and the comment.
   Many thanks,
   Ted.

10. Dunno why it didn’t link for you Ted. Try copy/paste this:
    http://dustmybroom.com/?p=2839#comments

11. Unbelievable:
    Would you be in favour of abolishing native and Metis reserves and treaty rights to live under the British Common Laws we are all under (except Quebec with Napoleonic)?
    Would you be in favour of while retaining your rich cultural heritage, but becoming a common Canadian, pay taxes, and live in cities/towns or homesteads?
    Would you be willing not to require special treatment and status at bargaining tables for municipal expansion plans? Hint: Calgary Ring Road…
    Till then, I can’t see how things will change.

12. Well put Unbelievable. The present system doesn’t work and needs to be changed. It does neither side any good. I have aboriginal friends who also rebel against the dependancy thing. Like anyone else, they sweat and toil only to see this. They are proud of their heritage, and proud of not gorging on the entitlements.I dunno what the magic mix is, but it isn’t the current one!Clearly I am frustrated with the present system. You are right, change needs to come from within. The was a doco done by an aboriginal chief in the US, Hopi nation I think. He started steering his people back toward their roots. Their traditional diets, customs, teachings etc. Their health improved so much that many diseases (diabetes etc) were on the decline. With improved health came improved mental health, pride, initiative etc. From there, it just got better! I really wish I could remember the documentary, it was very fascinating and informative. Perhaps there’s something in there for the people up here? I do know it was on a channel like PBS or Discovery, as that is what I usually watch.

13. Bugger! Looks like I’m not gonna get a long frosty! *sigh* Mind you… the aboriginal population in Australia comes pretty close. Hmmm… another former Brit colony. Does that count? for a short frosty perhaps? 😀

14. Snookie, not to play the devil’s advocate, but this “going back to one’s roots” might sound all warm and fuzzy, but it doesn’t really work in today’s global economy reality.
    Sure, a good diet plan would help anyone, even us whities. Same with spiritual things. Apart from Casio�s all over the place, what other industry could be the catalyst to get them on their feet? Fur trapping isn’t really ‘cool’ right now.
    Plus souvenir trinkets and blankets don’t pay that well either, just ask the Mexicans down in Tijuana.
    Speaking of paying, what about paying taxes? Then there’s a sticky point about ending certain privileges like hunting lobster, trout, and moose out of season.
    You know, that gushy being equal with all men of all colours type thing I keep hearing about.
    As to 400+ years ago living in “relatively peaceful life” – well I dunno, Blackfoot (Siksika), Blood, Peigan, Crow, Cree, Chipewyan, and Metis didn’t seem to get along, even today. I used to play hockey with them up at Cold Lake eh…
    Really to be callous, I guess I could have summed it up by saying all it takes to turn around is some willpower.
    cheers
    tom

15. Liberalism: We’re the tender father and strong mother you always wanted — and all the God you’ll ever need.

16. Oh, dear. I guess this is the opening salvo of the new conservative war on Aboriginal peoples. It usually starts like this.
    What you fail to point out, kate…purely an oversight, of course, your dedication to journalistic rigour is well known…is that
    a) Many of the programs and services you list here are wide open to anyone who needs them, and
    b) Many are programs delivered from the same little facility by the same overworked crew of volunteers.
    Nice sneer, though.

17. balbulican – Although I can’t say for sure you are right about the programs being open to everyone – having lived in a community 10 km north of a four band reserve I can certainly say that the problems are not only within the reserve (gangs, drugs, murders, abuse etc. etc. etc) but spill over into the towns directly surrounding those reserves.
    (OF course – I am saying all this in a whisper into your ear because it is “politically incorrect” to say these things out loud – so don’t tell anyone OK)
    It is my opinion that many people – both native and non-native, businesses, agencies and a myirad of others benefit from keeping the native people exactly like they are – dependant on the government to take care of them – having their governing elders dispersing money all the while being told they deserve this for their “land” being stolen.
    Having lived in a community close to a reserve – albeit a wealthy one – I saw first hand how there was a real co-dependant relationship between the natives and the businesses in the adjoining community. Because of the huge bundles of money handed out on “paydays”, a dearth of bingo halls, liquor stores, car dealerships and other businesses became successful businesses.
    So it is in the best interests of many, many people to keep things just like they are. Maybe someone should actually go and ask the common first nations man or women what they want instead of their “leaders” around a table who negotiate a deal with no strings attached (hmmm sound like the daycare agreements).
    end of whispering.
    As to your second point – there are hard working people in all agencies and I for one admire them.

18. “we’re from the governmnet, we’re here to help you’
    The pusher and the addicts . . . .

19. Is this where I come if I want to complain about all the unfair advantages First Nations People have? And is it better if I sound really angry and hard-done by?
    As another poster states, you really should provide some context here: are these services solely for the use of FN people? In any case, in a 3km area around where I live, there are way more services than that for a particular cultural group…driver’s license office, several christian churches, at least 5 public schools, 2 libraries…well, too many to count, really.
    I’ll have a tall frosty Efes Pilsen…a good Turkish beer, if you don’t mind.

20. Kate – you have not specified whether the services are government funded or not (I know for the Aboriginal services you assume they are all government funded – which I do not argue). However, because you do not specify government funded I believe I have you for that tall frosty beer.
    I think Chinatown in Calgary (or Chinatowns in other Canadian or American cities) would have more services for a cultural group within a 3 Km radius.
    I will meet you in the liquor store in La Loche, SK. to collect my beer. No wait – thats a government run service for Aboriginal people, although anybody can get liquor there, and the manager just ripped the store off for a few hundred thousand. You probably wouldn’t set foot in that place. Oh well, maybe a a sports bar in an acceptable neighborhood somewhere?

21. I think you need to read the link.

22. You can see from reading this article that the various HAND HOLDING agencies that you have described represent employment for hundreds of people. These entitlement, nurturing and bogus cultural entities are a big business. “Solving” the various problems these folks deal with would result in the loss of their jobs. That’s why nothing will improve, and likely get worse, with these people running the show.

23. Please excuse my ignorance here. I have read the link a number of times – The headline is: 23 Free Trappers to �Rod Bruinooge Congratulations Watch�.
    What do any of the postings on that page have specifically to do with the services in Winnipeg for Aboriginal people? Most of what I see is a debate about how Rod B. is being shortchanged as a poster boy for conservativism.
    Is the message hidden between the lines?
    I still think you owe me a beer.

24. I had originally cut my posting down because thought it was too long, and I see I should have just kept rambling on.
    Seeing Kate doesn’t need defence for posting a real life topic, I wonder if this “lets go back to our roots” thing I see in a lot of government programs is just window dressing to keep the First Nation people suppressed.
    Having lived up at Cold Lake, there are three FN reserves and a handful of Metis settlements within a 50km radius. Some of the larger ones in Alberta and Saskatchewan too.
    And also having worked at a MacLeods Hardware store and a GM Dealership in Grand Centre it was a standing joke we knew when the ‘payday’ dole was being handed out by the amount of traffic and drunk natives on the streets. The local lumber yards appreciated the government contracts being handed out to build new homes and “culture centres” on the reserves and settlements.
    Heck, near Bonnyville, I believe 12-15 brand new cedar homes were built for the reserve there. Within a year’s time half of them were being torn apart for, get this, firewood. What a shame.
    It was also, uh, amusing for my friends working at the Esso Gas Plant on payday. One group got a nice fat cheque, the other group got about 64% of their cheque. Do I need to digress who’s who?
    So yes, a lot of business, from Hardware stores, to IGA, to GM dealerships depend on dole day for the natives. Fact of life for small towns to survive, Lord knows it’s not farmers income.
    Vicious circle. Many bureaucrats livelihoods also depend on government positions to “oversee” the billions (1.6/month comes to mind) of dollars handed out.
    What I’m upset is the waste and wasted futures because of this welfare state the government has created and brought them up in. Where is this retort of “being a proud nation” in refusing to get off the dole?
    Oh, I’m told because of whiteman’s poison, err spirits (read: alcohol). Yes blame everyone, blame what happened many years ago, blame this, blame that, get a government program going, send money. Round round we go.
    For the ones who do try to get off, they are persecuted (you read that right) and made fun of. One friend moved off the reserve (yes lost his status), worked at Esso, raised a family, but tells me the harassment he gets when he goes back to visit family. Same thing with those who attended our church…”bowing to whiteman’s God”.
    I had in 1998 a RCMP buddie who confided in me he “accidentally” got a federal budget (complete with payrolls) of Joesph Bighead reserve in his interdepartmental mail, instead of the budget for his local detachment in Pierceland. (Don’t ya love screwups like this?)
    Back then band chiefs were getting $60,000 tax free, and band council members $45,000 tax free. Note, this isn’t for every one living on the reserves, but those who sit 4 times a year in a meeting to dole out where the band money goes.
    Well I know where some of it went. $400,000 combine sitting in the field rusting because something broke. So they went and bought another one.
    Forget about what happened in the past and who stole what, geeze, I mean what’s done is done, let’s move on.
    First step is to give up your entitlements, like I listed, hunting and fishing out of season (then selling it to the white men), next give up your bingo halls and make a community that has evolved and advanced. Worshops, schools, hospitals, you know like, towns. Teepee’s don’t cut it in this day and age.
    As I said before, fur trapping and blanket weaving just doesn’t pay.
    You’re not special, you’re Canadian now. (Then again tell that to Quebecers…and other vocal special interest groups).
    *sigh*
    Why bother…here’s your cheque, go away please…
    we’re also to blame for the political correct society we live in. No one fails school anymore, NHL hockey, no one really looses, on and on.
    Maybe I should go back and live in the bush. Oh wait, how’d I get onto the Internet and daily does of Kate’s ramblings?
    Gosh, maybe we don’t have it so bad after all.
    cheers
    Tom

25. The area in question appears to be the old downtown of Winnipeg and out towards the North End.For decades it has been a blight on the city and attempts at urban renewal have stalled consistently.It is where the immigrants came to so many years ago with many Scottish street names.It is the area of Winnipegs core that has remained largely unchanged.Winnipeg has long been a destination point for aboriginals who move away from the reserve and with the large number of reserves in the province the city has the largest native population per capita in Canada.The volunteers who go out in 30 below to pull people out of snowbanks at 2 am do great work as do many others.People need help and the reason they do is the systemically flawed approach stretching back over a hundred years.

26. I think you should all spend more time reading the Blogs on Dustmybroom!
    The list of service providers you posted does include many that are not targeted to aboriginals at all…but the many that are can be used as examples of how (As Mysterymeat points out) there is a culture of paternalism that pervades the social services business. And I use the word Business deliberately! If you approached any member of this nurse nanny establishment with a proposal that would fundamentally change the socio-economic situation of native people they would not be receptive. Just try it. It’s this group who most loudly protest any suggestions of change. Why? Because it is not in their interest.

27. Ack! Sorry – I pasted in the wrong DMB link. No wonder there was confusion. I apologize, and it’s now fixed.

28. …would you be in favour of something that would take your job, career, and morgage payments away?
    Especially after being brainwashed in University that our society today is “enlightened”, and “cares for the down and out”, and is politically correct, and these poor people don’t know how to survive in whiteman’s savage society?
    Can you blame them?

29. Thanks, Kate for fixing the link. Now I know its the Dust My Broom guy that owes me a beer.
    I don’t agree with your and all of your posters who, in knee jerk fashion, see services to Aboriginals as bad. At the same time, I think things need to be repaired in the way the Aboriginal community sees itself.
    This process will take time and understanding – from both sides. I don’t think rants like Dust My Broom, or the things posted on this site by some members (tomax – laughing at drunk Indians on welfare day) help matters at all.
    I think most people who complain about Aboriginal rights would shut right up if they received some of the “benefits” they beleive Aboriginal people receive. It boils down to basic jealousy.
    I would encourage people to read about the history of our country. About how the fur trade exploited the Aboriginal population to the point of encouraging them to over trap and become dependant on the company store. About how the government signed treaties with Aboriginals to get the Hudson Bay Company off the hook for the Aboriginal people who were now dependant on store credit because there were no more animals to trap. About how the churches were recruited to assimilate the Aboriginals with mainstream Canada to get the government out of its treaty obligations and to get conctrol over treaty lands.
    This, fellow Canadians, is our heritage. Now you are going to clean up the mess by bitching about services for Aboriginal people?

30. I think most people who complain about Aboriginal rights would shut right up if they received some of the “benefits” they beleive Aboriginal people receive. It boils down to basic jealousy.
    Heh, who would pay for them?

31. I would encourage people to read about the history of our country. About how the fur trade exploited the Aboriginal population to the point of encouraging them to over trap and become dependant on the company store.
    Too bad the Liberals weren’t around to save you from yourselves.

32. remember the “definition of insanity”? doing the same thing over and over yet expecting a different result?
    +100 years of not having these people integrated into the mainstream of our society, has led to this.
    yet the waves of immigrants in these past 100 years left everything behind to come here, and they have flourished.
    why? well, the best social program… is a job.
    I will not say, that these “drop in centers” haven’t any use, only perhaps, that they need to be open in the evenings, and not in “normal” school or working hours.

33. As a long time former Winnipeg resident, I can tell the North End area well. Having driven thru the Higgins and Main intersection and north on Main to and from work – this is the largest reserve – urban or remote in Canada. In a city of about 600k a native or metis population approaching 10% is one with huge social and crime problems. Spend one night at the emergency ward of the downtown hospital and people with a Disneyland view of natives will suddenly be confronted with reality.

34. Hoss – so its Aboriginals’ fault they were exploited by the fur trade, the church, and the government?
    Folks, you are witnessing the “blame the victim” phenomenon at its finest.
    Hoss buddy – all you want is a treaty number.
    Like I said, “I think things need to be repaired in the way the Aboriginal community sees itself.
    This process will take time and understanding – from both sides. I don’t think rants like Dust My Broom, or the things posted on this site by some members (tomax – laughing at drunk Indians on welfare day) help matters at all.”
    I am not saying everything is good the way it is. But these cyber lynching exercises of Aboriginal people do no one any good.

35. North Sask: “It boils down to basic jealousy”
    Ha! Give me a break!
    Yes, the natives were exploited, yes, they were confined to parcels of land, yes they get free benefits us “basic jealous” types don’t. Yes some are living in third world conditions…
    Yes my mother escaped Communism, yes my grandparents were gassed, yes my mom’s boss took advantage of her (work wise you perv) with low pay because of her English skills, yes a priest in the RC church tried to molest me, yes we don’t live on welfare, yes my Mom is bitter the British types in Vancouver snub her, yes yes yes yes.
    So what the $#@%@#%$ do you want Sask boy? Geeze.
    Now, let’s review history – who is whining and who isn’t. Who PAID and is PAYING FOR those free benefits our poor indigenous people are suffering about?
    Hmmm…gives a different slant on being just basic jealous.
    Get your facts right. Plus I don’t laugh at drunk Indians, I said it was a standing joke and they are ‘natives’ in my book. Read the meaning, not just the words.
    Not sure if you meant “HOW” instead of “NOW”, but your last statement is a winner:
    “Now you are going to clean up the mess by bitching about services for Aboriginal people”
    WAIT. Why don’t YOU clean up your own dang mess?
    Huh?
    Responsibility, accountability, and interoperability.
    What a concept.
    cheers
    tom

36. From North Sask, the simple truth is people are sick of their tax dollars, put towards “woe is me” victim signs.
    One of the reasons many Canadians of any colour don’t have their own is they are to busy earning a living, and learning from THEIR mistakes.

37. NorthSask – Your post defines the general opinion of the “victim mentality” that somehow we deserve this for all the wrongs that were done to us. I do not see the things that the Natives get through jealous eyes but rather as opportunity wasted. I can’t imagine being given outright with no strings attached benefits such as an education or a house or a myriad of other benefits and not taking advantage of them, appreciating them and using them to pull myself and my family up and out of the reserve system that attempts to hold me back. That is what sickens me – that the opportunities are there, not taken advantage of (or used, abused and thrown away) and then complaining that more needs to be done.
    And believe me – native people are not the only ones who work the system.
    This post of course does not include the many native people that have used the system to better their lot in life and become productive and appreciative members of the Canadian Society. Why shouldn’t all natives experience that same lot.
    If the money that has been sunk into Native Affairs over the past century had reached each Native – do you realize that each Native would be a millionaire. Why are they not standing up and screaming about the corruption and scandal in their own department and demanding that it be cleaned up. No they complain that the conservatives want to “tear up” the no strings attached Kelowna accord because it would put millions into more beauracracy!
    Give me a break – it is time that we gave Natives a helping hand by getting rid of Native Affairs and getting the money directly to the people who need it!!!!!!

38. Hoss – so its Aboriginals’ fault they were exploited by the fur trade, the church, and the government?
    Oh I get, the fur traders forced “my people” to trade fur. The fur traders forced “my people” to over trap which, in turn, forced dependence on the company store, church charity and gov’t handouts.
    In other words, “my people” were forced to be vicdumbs. Not only that, the descendants are forced to continue being vicdumbs.

39. This is from Sask “boy”. I like that. Just call me boy. Tomax, I feel for your family and I respect your family for what you have accomplished. I wish the respect was mutual.
    Again, I encourage you to understand the history of our country. Under the treaties, the Aboriginals ceded all of Canada in return for reserves, education, health care, exemption from taxes. Canada got all the rest – natural resources, minerals, everything. So who got the better deal?
    Again, I’m not saying everything is hunky dorey in Indian Country. However, lets please approach this issue in a spirit of mutual respect. And it would help if you educated yourself a bit.

40. I think we should remove the reserve system as fast as possible.
    How long are we to pay for the injustices done in the distant past to native people?
    When does it end? Will my childrens children face the same issues on this?
    Can’t we decide as a nation that we all are equal and no group of people are superior to all others?
    We have payed off natives and segregated them from mainstream society.
    This has made them vulnerable to exploitation from without (vote buying with promises of handouts) and within (band leaders abuse of power).
    Hopefully Mr Prentice will be able to turn the situation arround and move towards integration. Sadly, it will take generations before it is possible.

41. North Sask – I apologize for calling you Sask boy, it was done in a frustrating mood.
    As for “if you educate myself a bit”, uh…now what does that mean?
    As for “spirit of mutal respect” you already have that, I treat everyone the same. You just make it harder to appreciate your culture by living off my taxes. Not ‘you’ in particular, figuratively speaking for those who jump at words.
    I have seen first hand the wrong doings of our government towards the Native population (First Nation if you must).
    I have also seen the lack of incentive to get out of the bog of laziness and accountablility by the same Native population.
    What more “education” do I need?
    I need to see ‘you’ getting out of the mess there is right now, I don’t care whoever created it, but do something.
    First thing I’d say your on the right track is pay taxes. Heck the Queen pays taxes (insert laugh, but point made).
    Second thing is remove special issues like hunting and fishing out of season. Nice to remind me that is your heritage, uh, well, things change and you better also.
    Definately the Native population is in a nanny state, just like the leftsided airheads…
    Never mind, I need more edumacation from a feel good social program.
    Uh, do I have to pay for it?
    cheers
    tom

42. I’m sure most of the posters here naturally respect those that earn it, or at least try to.

43. From North Sask.
    only a low percentage of the natives are covered by treaties.
    europeans were here in numbers for 400 years before they got into the high numbers for treaties. treaty No. 6 and treaty no.7.
    very few treaties in BC, Ontario or Quebec and certainly none in Nfld.
    I think education, health care , and taxes in the public domain are all very much modern post first world war concepts.
    reserves,seeds, guns and ammo were the concept of the day.
    Cant always put modern values or notions on things done in the late 1800s.

44. for a new take on “first nations” google “kennewick man” or this
    http://www.utexas.edu/courses/stross.ant322m_files/1stpersons.htm

45. Tomax – Thanks for the apology on the “boy” comment. It is appreciated.
    I see I am waging a one man war here on treaties, Aboriginal rights etc. But heck, if I wanted people to agree with me I would post on a “liberal, Pimp” blog.
    As I have said, I think things need to be fixed in Canada-Aboriginal relations and in how Aborigionals see themselves and relate to mainstream society.
    However, most Aboriginals covered by treaty believe they have paid their taxes. This occurred when Canada was ceded through the treaties. Was that not enough?
    The first step from your side in a rational negotiation would be acknowledgement of Aboriginal rights which were supported through the treaties.
    The first step from the Aboriginal side would be acknowledgement that the taxpayers of Canada do not owe them a living. (betcha never thought I’d say that!)
    I’m saying, lets sit down and negotiate a business deal. What is the fair price to pay for all the natural resources of Canada?

46. I’m saying, lets sit down and negotiate a business deal. What is the fair price to pay for all the natural resources of Canada?
    How about what they were worth at the time the treaties were negotiated?
    Let’s see, the U.S. got all of Alaska for 7.2 million.
    Of course, we’ll have to deduct monies paid in the interim.

47. Let’s see, the U.S. got all of Alaska for 7.2 million.
    Yes, and they paid that to Russia. In that case the Aboriginals got nothing.
    So, Hoss, if I am correct, you think that the fair price for Canada would be say, 100 times what was paid for Alaska, seeing how Canada actually has farmland, open shipping lanes to Europe, etc. So 720 million in, say 1800 dollars. What has the inflation rate been since then? Maybe 200% (a Conservative figure – no pun intended). Now the value is $14.4 BILLION. Now we add interest, compounded over 200 years. Hmmmm …. that comes to $237 TRILLION now, Oh yeah, we’ll subtract the paltry 100 billion or so that has been spent on supporting those Indian bums by hard working Canadian taxpayers like you.
    I like you Hoss, lets negotiate!
    I recommend you take a Native Studies 100 level class sometime.
    NEXT Question!

48. The compound interest was calculated at 5% per annum by the way.

49. I suggest that the First Nations Perks should only be available to those who can PROVE that they are 100% Native. No mixed blood folks need apply. That would eliminate about 99.999% of the folks who claim to be First Nations.

50. …you think that the fair price for Canada would be say, 100 times what was paid for Alaska…
    Your calculations are a little off. Actually, a lot off.
    Alaska has about 656,000 square miles and Canada has about 6,204,186 square miles. That’s less than a factor of 10.
    Oh yeah, we’ll subtract the paltry 100 billion or so that has been spent on supporting those Indian bums by hard working Canadian taxpayers like you.
    Don’t forget the interest, compounded over 200 years.